1. Are you a current member with account or password issues?

    Please visit following page for more information

    Dismiss Notice

Why do you want the end of the world to happen so badly?

Discussion in 'The Breakroom' started by Rawls, Jan 20, 2011.

  1. iacchus

    iacchus Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2010
    Messages:
    1,344
    Likes Received:
    628
    Rawls,
    I think what you are keying in on is pure fantasy.
    People work in cubicles and go home at night to couches and television sets or computer monitors. There is a major disconnect between people and nature.
    I think much of the fixation on the crumbling of civilization you have noticed stems from simple fantasy about connecting with nature in the raw. Look at the popularity of outdoor survival shows and the like.
    If everything came down around our ears, the things that disconnect us from the world are immediately removed. I think what you see is a subconscious desire for that, nothing more.
    I do not think many people really want to see "the end of the world". I do think many people are somewhat dissatisfied with the banality of modern existence and are at a loss about what to do about that.
     
  2. DBR

    DBR Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2006
    Messages:
    2,125
    Likes Received:
    1,432
    I tell you true, when confronted with the inevitability of a question, I often resort to hitting it right on the pate. Like a cat, a question almost always blinks twice when hit with a ball peen hammer. :cool:
     
  3. tower
    • In Omnia Paratus

    tower Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2009
    Messages:
    4,591
    Likes Received:
    3,753
    What are you talking about? This is more of your own interpretation on the meaning of things and misdirection! I have asked you, repeatedly, for quotation from anyone here which shows a wish for the end of the world and you have failed again and again. You should put up or... You are living in a fantasy of your own creation. I don't mean this to be hostile, you just can't back up your claim except for saying that something "must mean" that. Again, no concrete support save your own interpretation.

    Here is what I believe to be the nidus of your misinterpretation. I don't know if you have noticed, but on this forum, you can find people of considerable intellect and real world experience in unusually difficult and harsh circumstances. Should a global catastrophe occur, on this forum, you are rubbing shoulders with a high percentage of people who will likely be responsible for saving the planet (or at least the human race). That is what you are misinterpreting. No one here is wishing for it.
     
  4. Mdiggyy

    Mdiggyy Empty Pockets

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2011
    Messages:
    19
    Likes Received:
    0
    I agree^. I wouldn't so far as to say that people are HOPING for it. But just as it is bad to focus solely on the negative, it is also bad to focus on only the positive. Sure, some of the EOTW stuff we're hearing nowadays is a bit extreme, superstitious, etc. But it's better to at least recognize and be aware of the fact that it CAN and inevitably WILL happen. I think that theres nothing more dangerous than someone who is naive and unwilling to accept the truth. When it comes down to it, regardless if the world is coming to an end sooner or later, we will all die at some point and it's important that people realize it without dwelling on it.
     
  5. DBR

    DBR Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2006
    Messages:
    2,125
    Likes Received:
    1,432
    "Hoping" or "wishing," eh, whatever. If this great country, The United States of America, is not going to rebound with excellent jobs for anyone who wants to work and if wages are going to continue to stagnate or go down in the face of every thing else from housing to food to utilities and clothing going up and up...if this is just the long slide into mediocrity and then into whatever that weakness leads us into with other people on the planet - I quite simply do not "care." The reason I don't "care" is because it does no good anyway. I'm not going to change anything, I'm just along for the ride, I'm simply a passenger on what I believe to be a runaway freight train. I'm not driving it. If the final paradigm is, the rich get even richer than they ever did before and the poor get even more poor than they ever did before, I couldn't care less if it all collapses. Why care? It's obvious that so many people worked so hard for that to be the end result of their avarice, they should have seen it coming.
     
  6. Monocrom

    Monocrom Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2009
    Messages:
    8,035
    Likes Received:
    8,228
    In reference to only having a BOB to rely on, then yes.

    In reference to having a place you can get to that has been stocked before-hand, the story becomes different.

    Several nuclear warheads going off all over the world is different from a virus that wipes out much of the world but would leave some survivors and the land intact.
     
  7. DBR

    DBR Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2006
    Messages:
    2,125
    Likes Received:
    1,432
    Another run of anything like the Spanish Flu of the early 1900s, which ended World War One more than any desire for peace, would leave hundreds of millions dead, if not a billion people. That is if it were on the same scale as the three waves of it back then adjusted to today's modern air travel, higher population, etc. How many of those would be people that treat water for urban and suburban areas? How many would be people that keep the power grid up and running which is terribly antiquated anyway? Police, Firefighters and ParaMedics? Doctors, nurses and all related healthcare staff that run not only hospitals and clinics and their own, personal offices but nursing homes, etc.? It's not that the flu would kill you because you caught the flu, you could be killed because of all of the aftershocks of the lack of services, etc.

    It just doesn't have to be "The Stand" or "I Am Legend" to kill an incredible amount of people across the globe.

    Back then, people could still go out and shoot something or throw a hook in the water and pull something out and clean it and cook it. Even cooking outside if they had to. They were totally unconcerned with all of the PETA-related nonsense of Veganism, etc. They were closer to animals than the grocery store, even the people in the cities back then, many of them kept chickens in the backyard, for example. Today? Many people that harbor and embrace these demonstrably anti-homo sapiens ideas would be adapting rather quickly or dying off. And that's how natural selection really works anyway, isn't it? The articificial environment where people can let their emotions dictate their lives would be gone and necessity would dictate a return to being a human being instead of whatever it is that we have become. Some of us have become, anyway.

    How long would it take to restore power and water treatment and food processing and three dozen other things to keep cities alive? Truck drivers, I forgot the truck drivers! You know, the people most people look down on as dirtbags. Hell, if they went on strike tomorrow, several cities would be rioting within seven days. National Guard Units would be passing out MREs and U.N. Rations like this is some Third World Country because the truth of the matter is, just a few things go wrong in a chain and we are a Third World Country with Cholera and everything else running rampant.
     
  8. Rawls

    Rawls Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2008
    Messages:
    1,693
    Likes Received:
    250
    In the 16th and 17th century, right around the time the New World and its inhabitants were entering into public consciousness in Europe, people became fascinated with "the state of nature". It figured heavily, as metaphor, in the works of Thomas Hobbes (his social contract and king emerged out of the war of each against all that represented life in the state of nature) all the way through Jean Jacques Rousseau (his noble savage from the Second Discourse).

    I think this fascination and fantasizing about the end of the world is our modern equivalent--a hypothetical device used to winnow away concepts and trappings of modern life to find what is the essence or core of our existence.

    I had hoped by quickly dashing the thought about the real end of the world (for which preparation is almost certainly futile, by way of the two examples cited in the OP), that we could discuss why people fantasize about this. Some folks got it (DBR) and some didn't. It would have been like somebody quarreling it Thomas Hobbes about what kind of pen he would bring to sign the social contract. Oh well. If the OP offended some folks, I apologize. I should have made it clear that I did not REALLY care about the REAL end of the world. I was also insensitive to people's focus on the actual disaster. I also did not need to include the demographic information (though I believe it to be accurate). Liberals have their own end scenarios--an environmental disaster, a depletion of oil a la Mad Max--so I could have made the same demographic analysis for the liberal equivalent.

    So to refocus (or maybe just close this thread): why is the end of the world a useful theoretical tool to analyze our modern condition?
     
  9. DBR

    DBR Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2006
    Messages:
    2,125
    Likes Received:
    1,432
    See my last post.

    What is oftentimes seen as strength is only an illusion. Or, in this case, mass delusion. Our way of life is fragile. The occasional flat tire or monkeywrench in the cogs of progress won't cause so much as a belch. But living things you cannot see without the aid of a microscope could change our way of life forever. And that is not the only thing that could happen, just one thing.
     
  10. cap6888
    • In Omnia Paratus

    cap6888 Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2009
    Messages:
    699
    Likes Received:
    60
    IMO, this sums things up pretty well as to why many of us prepare. Those of us that have spent time in "third world countries" and have seen what life is like without any real infrastructure, we have some fortunate insight as to what may be. I can tell you from my experience in working in an area that has very low socio-economic status, people just expect to have things handed to them. "Work" is a four letter word to many of them. Most just head down to the local store with their WIC cards and get their food without even having to have any job to even earn the money to work for it. Never mind if the system collapsed, the only thing they would know how to do is loot the stores. Once the stores were empty, they would be totally screwed. My hat's off to DBR for many good points. Often times I do not agree with his views, but he has done a good job with this one.
     
  11. iacchus

    iacchus Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2010
    Messages:
    1,344
    Likes Received:
    628
    I would like to point out something. I'm not sure how well this fits in the thread, but it is an issue that is close to me, and somewhat germane.
    Different geographical populations within the larger civilization handle large disasters differently. After Katrina, much of the news cycle focused on the tragedy that was the flooding of New Orleans. You didn't see much coverage of South Mississippi. I do not want to downplay what happened with NO, but here in S. MS, we lost cities. The hurricane hit us, while the disaster in NO was a matter of levees being breached after the hurricane.
    The city of Waveland was wiped clean. Only one building was left standing (a public works facility), Biloxi beach was destroyed, Pascagoula and Ocean Springs beaches were demolished, along with every building there. Inland flooding was intense.

    The news focused on NO, because the people there were completely unprepared and had no idea how to deal with the disaster without outside intervention. The news did not focus much on South MS, mainly because the people here got to work fixing infrastructure and helping one another pick up what few pieces that were left of their lives. It took years to rebuild, but we did what was neccesary with little fanfare; we looked after our own.

    It is an interesting distinction. All society is not built the same, and depending on geographical location, populations handle major disasters quite differently.
     
  12. medic2807

    medic2807 Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2010
    Messages:
    849
    Likes Received:
    649
    I think being prepared tells a lot about a person. I have worked in emergency medicine, both as a paramedic and as a PA in an ER, have taken care of thousands of patients, and the prepared ones are easiest to take care of. The people that bring their kid into the ER after he/she has had a fever for 12 mins. because "we don't have any tylenol" is a prime example. I mean, who doesn't have Tylenol for their kid? I can tell you-people who don't want to work and who chronically consider themselves victims. In North Dakota, we could have a 0% unemployment rate if everyone wanted to work. We have the best economy in the nation, probably in the world right now. Alas, we still have quite a few who don't wanna work. They are also the same people who have the nicest cellphones, ironically. They are also the same people that text message while you try to get their history. Same group of people voted most likely to end up in the ER after drinking too much, using too many drugs, having a rap song for their ringtone, smell the most like feet, smell the most like cigarettes, visit the ER more than twice per year for STDs, visit the ER most often for "back pain", "migraine, and "fibromyalgia", demand the most, be accompanied to the ER at 3AM by an entourage of "besties", all with their assorted flotsam and jetsam of offspring, talk the loudest, steal the most supplies out of the exam rooms, feed their infants Mountain Dew, exercise the least, watch Jersey Shore, change their offspring's crappy diaper most infrequently and complain the most. So if that is the group of people who we wish for "the great leveling" of, I guess I'm guilty as charged.
     
  13. monkeysfistmaker

    monkeysfistmaker Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Nov 27, 2008
    Messages:
    169
    Likes Received:
    1
    So I have a good reason to use up my 4,000 rounds of .40cal Glock ammo. Just kidding. I would hate for the world to end. There needs to be an "end of the world" EDC thread.
     
  14. medic2807

    medic2807 Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2010
    Messages:
    849
    Likes Received:
    649
    I.E.-People who don't use EDC Forums.
     
  15. medic2807

    medic2807 Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2010
    Messages:
    849
    Likes Received:
    649
    I got sent to East Texas/Western Louisiana after Katrina/Rita. Ended up in the Beaumont/Port Arthur area, and points north. Basically, taking care of a lot of people just like me, but with southern accents. Talk about a great detail! Not a victim in the bunch! N.O., I hear, was another story...
     
  16. jda

    jda Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2010
    Messages:
    1,278
    Likes Received:
    1,218
    That is somthing to be proud of, esp. when no one is looking.



    Medic2807 - I can only begin to appreciate the :censored: that ER staff put up with. I have only been in the ER twice, most reacently for 3 broken ribs. The "man" in the bed over was there for a cut on his calf (minor by most standards). He spoke NOT A WORD of english, but he apparently lives here and has a wife with kids.(I can understand some spanish, but can't speak it)
    The entire time he was complaning ,in spanish, about the fact that he could not smoke in the ER, and how he needed to use a phone. The entire time I was there he did not shut up.
    I could not do your job, you must be much more understanding than I am.
     
  17. tower
    • In Omnia Paratus

    tower Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2009
    Messages:
    4,591
    Likes Received:
    3,753
    This is for Rawls,

    I accept your apology, though it did seem a little half-hearted. However, I WAS offended, there is no IF about it. And I think it is important for you to know why. You don't know me. You come out of left field and claim things about me which are not true. Even if they were, you would have no way of knowing that. The whole thing I find quite insulting. Even in you apology, you say, "I had hoped... ...that we could discuss why people fantasize about this." Respectfully I submit that you are the only one fantasizing about this. The rest of us are merely preparing for difficult times. For many of us, it is our job to do so. For all of us, we consider it our own personal social obligation to take care of ourselves, our own, and whomever else we can cover. We do not deem it appropriate to usurp scant resources in times of dire need, when a little forethought can abate the need to do so. I think a more valuable pursuit for you, would be to examine your own psyche, rather than all of ours. I suspect that such examination might support you acting more appropriately in a group setting. But what do I know, I'm just a dumb vegetarian, medical provider-rescue worker who uses today's modern air travel and lives in a densely populated area. :winkwink:
     
  18. Rawls

    Rawls Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2008
    Messages:
    1,693
    Likes Received:
    250
    Tower,

    I do sincerely apologize. I had no way of knowing, as you point out, that: a) you thought I was making these claims about you personally; or b) that you would be offended by me making these claims. I did not have anyone in mind when I wrote the OP. It was more designed to knock down one silly argument quickly, get to a more interesting issue, and be provocative. 8 pages later, I think it worked. I also think that a lot of comments have helped me understand where folks are coming from. Self-sufficiency is among the more commendable traits. I too aim to be as self-sufficient and prepared as possible and being here helps me learn how to do that better.

    If I knew that someone would take such personal offense to what I wrote I would not have wrote it as I did. I was trying to be provocative but not insulting. Sorry.
     
  19. Monocrom

    Monocrom Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2009
    Messages:
    8,035
    Likes Received:
    8,228
    Only time I was ever admitted into a hospital was a few years ago when I went to the ER for the very first time. My first roomy was an elderly gentleman. Few days later, it was a crackhead who had nearly O.D.ed. He spoke English. He was polite. He didn't complain. Didn't try to smoke. Surprisingly nice for a drug addict.
     
  20. DBR

    DBR Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2006
    Messages:
    2,125
    Likes Received:
    1,432
    There have been some fairly atrocious things said in this thread over the last couple days. Early this morning before work, I composed a few responses and then deleted them without posting them. I did the same thing this evening. I wanted to address some borderline racism and class bigotry and a few other things. People looking through the wrong end of the telescope, blinded or myopic because some people, on both sides of the political spectrum, are victims of their own experience.

    We are all, at times, victims of our own experience. Sometimes it's with personal relationships, sometimes gear or choice of vehicle...sometimes the way we look at the people around us. I'm guilty of it at times as well because I'm a human being.