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What's going on on England???

Discussion in 'The Breakroom' started by Rev. Chuck, Aug 8, 2011.

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  1. Stutoffee

    Stutoffee Loaded Pockets

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    To paraphrase the PM, NONE of this was about politics or protest, it was simply theft.

    Various lowlives around the country just wanted an excuse to go out & have a bit of fun, destroying & burning property, & fighting the Police.
    Many of these animals clearly just fancied a new pair of trainers, a new tracksuit or a bigger TV set (Well, its nice to have a Goal in life!)

    The usual round of do-gooders, apologists & "yoof" workers have been on TV stating that this happens because the kids have got nowhere to go & nothing to do, What absolute CRAP, IF youve got "nothing to do" it really isnt an excuse to go out and commit acts of crime.

    Heres hoping that swift justice will be served & that the violent, un-educated, underclass involved in this will have their state benefits taken off them, but again, I wont hold my breath.
     
  2. Mr_Moe

    Mr_Moe Loaded Pockets

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    "violent, un-educated, underclass" = "animals"?
     
  3. archer

    archer Loaded Pockets

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    What your saying then is that you Government is oppressive as Syria or China or Libya and all this is justified?

    Let the hooligans do whatever they please and then you can really call yourself, liberal, peace loving and
    a true human activist.
     
  4. blacmud8

    blacmud8 Loaded Pockets

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    I'm sorry but you are obviously so oblivious of the culture/social situation of the people in the areas that this is happening that your reply is ridiculous and is not really a constructive contribution to this thread at all.

    The British Government, thankfully, sees it as absolutely farcical to shoot and kill those that elect it to its power. If you think about it, that is absurd. Killed by the government you elected for leaving your house? I'm glad I don't live in THAT country.

    as phill says, there is no one right answer. He isn't saying you're all wrong to say that X or Y is the reason, he's saying it is wrong to say that only X or Y is the reason for all this. That is all.
     
  5. archer

    archer Loaded Pockets

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    There is a point or red line in every community, country or whatever that when crossed symbolises the complete meltdown of that particular community.

    It is the first and formoste responsibilty of the the same said country and government to protect it's citizens and the citizens hard earned property, if the country and government can't do that and restore and manetain law and order then it has no right to exist and I will never live in a place like that.

    If exterme measures have to be taken to protect innocent civilians and their property then it is completely ligitimate to use deadly force.

    If the hooligans knew that they are risking their lives then I would thing that the protests would be a less violent.

    It is very hypocritical to justify hooligan violence but condemm violence to restore law and order even if the hooligans have a right to vote.
     
  6. jag-engr
    • Administrator

    jag-engr Semper Bufo!
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    I would agree - there are no political demands involved and no one is actually protesting anything.
    People unhappy with the moral constraints of society are doing whatever they please when a social loophole presents itself. In other words, people who want to fight, steal, and destroy would normally refrain for fear of punishment. However they see others getting away with it and they think they can get away with it, too.

    This is just an outsider's observation, but society in the UK seems to traditionally have a strange tolerance for this sort of behavior, such as football hooliganism. Of course, this has gone to another level, but perhaps that is why the response has been slower and less decisive than it could have been.
     
  7. medic2807

    medic2807 Loaded Pockets

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    I feel bad for the British people who are really inhibited in their ability to defend themselves by the government. I don't mean for this to become a political/social debate, but I hope people from the UK remember this event when you go to the polls in future elections. If you believe you have the right to defend yourselves and carry a knife bigger than a small pocket knife, then run for office and change the laws. These looters know law-abiding folks over there are unarmed (heck, so are the cops for that matter) and are totally exploiting that fact. All I can say is, get a group of like-minded individuals together, strap on your EDC gear and go take your towns back. If any group is capable of it, the people who belong to forums like this are. Make an example. The cops aren't going to help you! Just taking to the streets in your neighborhoods will set an example.
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2024001/UK-riots-2011-London-Birmingham-people-forced-strip-naked-street.html
    Wouldn't it be nice if the guy stripping naked had an ASP baton or can of pepper spray in his hand?
     
  8. phill

    phill Loaded Pockets

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    Lol, every forum ive seen discuss this subject has the same back and forth.

    Trust me, we arent interested in your ideas about how awesome it is to shoot the rioters and we are doing fine without needing guns. In several days of mostly lawless rioting 4 people died, three of which seems to be accidental.

    The riots in Britain have reinforced that gun control is working great for us. Right now it seems to be all over but the rebuilding and the prosecutions, though with the weekend around the corner you are never quite sure if it will flair up again straight after. All in all the police did a great job.
     
  9. blacmud8

    blacmud8 Loaded Pockets

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    medic:

    We don't need guns. I don't feel unsafe. The looters weren't attacking people except for in a small handful of cases. If our populace was armed we would have hundreds dead after this.

    There have been a few Americans applying their American gun toting mindset to what is happening/ has happened in Britain on this thread. We have a totally different culture here, especially with regards to putting bullets into other human beings. No thank you.
     
  10. Mister Scribble

    Mister Scribble Loaded Pockets

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    I heard that the unemployment rate among black youth in the riot areas was about 55% or so. Lots of kids had lots of time on their hands during a hot summer, no work, frustration, lots of anger --> riots and looting. An old formula:

    "...cause Summer's here and the time is right
    For fighting in the street boys
    But what can a poor boy do
    Except to play in a rock 'n roll band?
    Cause in steamy London town there ain't no place for
    Street Fighting Man."

    -- The Rolling Stones

    I heard the police were also told to take a hands-off attitude. Well, they know their situation better than I do.

    Sorry to hear about all the destruction and some loss of life.
     
  11. Stutoffee

    Stutoffee Loaded Pockets

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    I can see why many would see the benefits in being armed to defend your home or business against Rioters, (and IF I had firearms & I was one of the victims Im sure Id have used them against rioters, although Im sure many experienced Police & Military people would tell you that you could still be in danger when faced with a huge hostile crowd) but unfortunately, IF many of the home & business owners HAD been armed with firearms, many of the rioters would have had firearms too.
    It would have been carnage with running firefights on the streets & many, many more deaths.

    I realise the riots have occured in the UK, but lets not turn this into yet another UK-bashing thread. OUR firearms & weapons laws are almost identical to EVERY COUNTRY except the US, so give it a rest!

    (I dont see these Riots as a "racial thing" either, there appears to have been criminals of many creeds & colours involved &, especially in the West Midlands area the Sikh & Muslim communities stood shoulder-to-shoulder with the rest of their neighbours in trying to protect homes, businesses & places of worship)
     
  12. DialM

    DialM Loaded Pockets

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    Well I guess we can assume you aren't a shop owner. There SHOULD be hundreds dead. Hundreds of dead looters. This kind of violence doesn't typically occur here because we are armed and it is assumed that everyone values their own life enough to not try to loot from armed citizens. Perhaps you should start writing checks to all those who were looted, since you personally value the lives of the scumbag looters over the shop owners' livelihoods. I would bet your mindset would change considerably if they decided to loot your home.
     
  13. DialM

    DialM Loaded Pockets

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    The benefits of being armed during unrest:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PmsKGhLdZuQ&feature=related
    Being in Los Angeles during these riots, I was called by a friend to extract her from a bad situation. I was glad to be armed. When someone calls you and is barricaded in her home while a building burns three doors down, you would be glad to be armed too. Calls to police went unanswered, and they weren't entering most of the riot areas at the time. The islands of relative safety were the areas that had some Korean shopkeepers on the rooftops with rifles, and their friends and family on the streets with pistols.
     
  14. Stutoffee

    Stutoffee Loaded Pockets

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    Well, IF you read my post youll see that yes IF I had a weapon Id have used it.
    BUT....IF everyone here could own arms, yes the home owners & business owners WOULD have had firearms BUT SO WOULD THE RIOTERS!!!!

    Not EVERYONE should be able to own a firearm! Not everyone in the UK (and yeah, youre right, very few do! Just as in many other countries!!) Not everyone in the US & Not everyone on this forum.

    Some people REALLY arent fit to own a sharpened stick, never mind a firearm.
     
  15. jemhouston

    jemhouston Loaded Pockets

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    Supposedly during the LA riots, Charlton Heston got calls from his anti-gun friends wanting to borrow guns. I’m not sure if he did.

    Due to a quirk in California gun laws at the time, any gun older than 1900 wasn’t subject to the waiting period. Every gun shop sold out of those guns during the riot.

    As for being armed during a riot, check with the Korean shop owners.
     
  16. xtrajack

    xtrajack Loaded Pockets

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    I agree.
     
  17. DialM

    DialM Loaded Pockets

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    Watch this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tgCiC6qTtjs and tell me who had firearms. With very few exceptions, it was thugs armed with crap they could pick up versus unarmed victims. Typically, rioters don't want to endanger their own lives against a well-armed citizen, even if the rioter has a firearm. Note the grocery store in that video being defended by armed citizens, and no looters in sight.
     
  18. Cheeser
    • In Omnia Paratus

    Cheeser Hey Bub!

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    Yes but following on from Stutoffee's post, if firearms were easily accessible then the looters would have had them and it would have been a different story, there was a story earlier in the week of looters who entered a restaurant with baseball bats and machettes and robbed the customers. If they had guns and the customers had guns.... well yeah.

    My position on this is a police officer from Australia. I am actually glad of our restrictive gunlaws and would hate to see the difference it would have made in England if firearms were more readily accessible
     
  19. DialM

    DialM Loaded Pockets

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    Um, his point was that rioters would have firearms too, well I posted videos from the L.A. Riots. Are you saying firearms were not easily accessible during the Los Angeles riots? LOL!
     
  20. bushidomosquito

    bushidomosquito Removed from forum.

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    In the U.S. we fight the silly mindset that everyone should be held accountable for the irresponsible actions of a small minority. The thought process of, "Well, some people aren't responsible enough to own a gun so I guess that right needs to be taken away from everyone" thankfully, escapes many of us here. And you have to see by now that it doesn't stop there. You have a special little sticky thread that tells you which knives your government currently trusts you to have on your person. Don't you Brits get a little envious of our full sized titanium frame locks? Doesn't it **** you off a little bit that you have to look for a special Nerf version of every knife by every manufacturer? I can't imagine how you feel about the discussions of gun holsters, tritium sights and Glock modifications. Here we're still fighting to carry automatic knives as we have fought against the ban on automatic firearms. It's not about what you "need" to own or carry, it's about the realization that irresponsible people need to be punished for their actions, not the society as a whole.

    Typical British EDC problem, "Now I think I can disable the lock but will the Bobbies measure the blade from tip to pivot or just the cutting edge?"
    Typical American EDC problem, "Now that I have G10 1911 grips that match my Hinderer, will my feed ramp be as polished as the next guy's?"

    Tell me again about how well this weapon banning mindset is working out for you.
     
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