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Watch Advice

Discussion in 'Watches' started by Ethos, Jul 19, 2017.

  1. Ethos

    Ethos Loaded Pockets

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    I'm thinking of getting my first GShock since an old used digital in junior high.

    I'm considering buying from Amazon where they have a fantastic price and good reviews, the company has over 54,000 rating which I'm guessing is their star rating. Only one other company comes close to that and is $20 more for the GShock Im looking at. There are over ten companies selling it, the highest price is $30 more.

    When I get it how can I tell if it's authentic? I trust Amazon to back what they sell so I don't mind trying it.

    Advice?
     
  2. Davidka

    Davidka Loaded Pockets

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    It sounds pretty safe but if you share a link to the watch sale page it would be easier to say.
     
  3. Ethos

    Ethos Loaded Pockets

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    Lol-is this a trick? :)
     
  4. kukla

    kukla Loaded Pockets

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    it really is amazing that there's so much counterfeit stuff is being sold in mainstream marketplaces these days
    on a Nissan forum that I frequent, some members have posted that they got counterfeit Chinese made NGK spark plugs that they purchased on eBay
     
  5. Ethos

    Ethos Loaded Pockets

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  6. Ethos

    Ethos Loaded Pockets

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    Nobody else has any thoughts?
     
  7. garza

    garza Loaded Pockets

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    Don't assume Amazon 3rd party affiliates only offer for sale genuine products. Amazon with the 3rd parties has a growIng problem with counterfeits.

    Yesterday I filed a warranty claim for a defective $50 phone case. Amazon 3rd parties were one group that would have voided the warranty as not an authorized retailer. Luckily I had purchased directly from AT&T. After emailing pictures of the defective case and receipt, I received a shipping notification of a replacement case.

    Check Casio's website for warranty limitations and if any conditions exist excluding sites from the warranty such as eBay, Craig's List, Amazon 3rd parties etc.
     
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  8. Moshe ben David

    Moshe ben David Loaded Pockets

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    You're correct to be cautious. I do buy watches from Amazon -- I have several. However.

    For things like watches, I generally stick with items "sold by' AND "fulfilled by" Amazon. Once in a while I might buy from a third party seller on Amazon, but I still stick with "fulfilled by" Amazon.

    Note that MANY watches on Amazon are essentially 'grey market'. Which means that the watches are authentic, but the seller is not authorized. In a lot of these situations, the watch warranty will NOT be through the manufacturer, but via a secondary outfit that handles warranty equivalent service. This is NOT an indication of a counterfeit. Grey markets arise in many watch, electronics, camera categories to name the most common. Manufacturer authorizes retailers -- essentially giving them unique authority to sell products in a territory. Grey market sellers sort of cheat the system by going into the manufacturer's home turf (e.g. Japan), buying bulk, and then bringing back to the sellers turf to sell at cheaper prices than the authorized sellers who adhere to MSRP.

    One other thing about watches on Amazon. Like many retailers, Amazon offers further discounts on 'open box' items. These are perfectly good (usually) items returned because a customer didn't want them. Such items can be found by searching at Amazon in the 'Amazon Warehouse' category. With watches though there is a distinct problem. Amazon specifically states that watches bought in the Amazon Warehouse category have NO WARRANTY. So I'd advise not buying these discounted items. Unless you like to repair your own or have access to a watchmaker on the cheap!

    L'chaim!

    Moshe ben David
     
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  9. Bellasdaddy

    Bellasdaddy Loaded Pockets

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    I have a question about "Grey Market." I have been a watch enthusiast for about 20 years and have heard this axiom used to specifically refer to unauthorized dealers. Where do the unauthorized dealers get the watches from in the first place?

    I completely understand that black market would suggest an item that was stolen or counterfeited and then fenced.

    But, I am not completely sold, for instance that "Amazon is a 'grey market' distributor" of seiko, g shock, etc.

    Where is Jeff Bezos getting the Seiko From? Unlikely from the back of a truck in the Bronx, and more likely directly from Seiko.

    My hunch is that "Grey Market" is a quirky marketing scheme/term that convinces the buyer that they are dabbling in the underworld and getting a great price on something expensive.

    More than likely I think Seiko, for instance, sells directly to Amazon and because Seiko washes their hands of any warranty responsibility, the watch can be discounted below the AD price
     
  10. Ethos

    Ethos Loaded Pockets

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    Amazon is a host for 3rd party vendors, very few things do they actually sell themselves. Amazon lets someone like you or I, or a company sell their products on their site or ship to their warehouses for fater hassle free distribution. They make money on the transaction, distribution fees, prime, music, and a variety of other Amazon branded products.
    If you get something counterfeit, it's most likely your getting it from a 3rd party vendor.

    What I meant in my OP was I wasn't confident of the third party seller, but if I got it and it wasn't right Amazon would protect the purchase.

    The vendor I bought from offers a two year warranty through them. The watch is authentic. They have sent numerous emails making sure I'm satisfied and reassuring me that if at any time I'm not satisfied or have any issues they will take care of it. I have a tendency to believe them due to their seller score and reviews.
    I was more concerned Iwas going to get a fake than anything
     
    Last edited by Ethos, Aug 3, 2017
    #10 Ethos, Aug 3, 2017
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2017
  11. ChadHahn

    ChadHahn Loaded Pockets

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    Grey market generally come from a retailer. Say you want to buy a Seiko which costs the watch shop $200. Seiko says that the cheapest they can sell that watch for is $300. But the watch shop sells the watch to a grey market seller for $220 who then sells it for $250. Everybody makes a little money and Seiko can't come back to the watch shop and say that they will no longer allow them to sell their watches because they are selling them too cheap.

    Chad
     
  12. McNasty

    McNasty Loaded Pockets

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  13. Bob Todrick

    Bob Todrick Empty Pockets

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    I've personally found that a lot of Amazon 3rd party deal with counterfeits. I now only buy from Amazon if it is actually from them.
     
  14. Moshe ben David

    Moshe ben David Loaded Pockets

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    Let me try to clarify from what I understand. I realize some of my understanding may be a bit out of date. I learned most of this when I lived in Asia (during the 80's and the 90's).

    I was not trying to imply that watches actually sold by Amazon -- as opposed to by a 3rd party on the Amazon platform -- are 'grey market'. I agree Amazon is large enough that it may not be a grey market distributor. But many on the platform I am sure are. No evidence; just an opinion. On the other hand, Amazon may be buying from Seiko (or Citizen or Casio or ...) at deep enough discounts that part of the deal is the OEM is not giving warranty support. I don't know.

    In general however. In grey market situations what often is happening is a grey market distributor goes to the OEM's home market (e.g., Japan) and buys in quantity from a legit distributor there. He then exports to the country in which he does business (e.g., US). The catch in global marketing (be it Seiko watches, Nikon cameras, MontBlanc pens, whatever), OEM's have signed agreements with local distributors giving those distributors actual license to sell the OEM's products in those markets.

    A grey marketer in contrast does NOT have the agreement in place with the OEM. As a result, the OEM often will refuse to provide after market support (e.g., warranty support) to a retail customer who buys the OEM's products via the grey market supply chain. Doesn't mean the product purchased is fake. It just means it was purchased outside the retail channel the OEM is working hard to support. Part of the problem from the OEM's point of view is the grey market channel is reaping the benefits of branding, market definition, etc., which the OEM and his distributors have invested time and money into but which the grey market guys are just taking advantage of -- and at the same time discount pricing to gain advantage over the other guys!

    Which sorta is why its called 'grey market'. Not exactly illegal. But not fully acceptable...

    In terms of watch warranties on Amazon, retail buyers (meaning us folk) need to be careful. On a product by product basis, read the fine print on the page(s) for the item, make sure you understand what is the warranty support situation for the particular item. Many times Amazon will indicate warranty support is via a third party outfit here in US. OTOH, Amazon is explicit in most cases that if you buy via Amazon Warehouse (which is how they sell at discount returned/open box items), there is NO warranty.

    To summarize. Buying grey market usually means the product is authentic. (I did say usually... Murphy's Law may apply). Just recognize that OEM warranty support is not there. There 'may' be a third party arrangement for warranty service.

    I hope this helps a bit.

    L'chaim!

    Moshe ben David
     
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  15. Bellasdaddy

    Bellasdaddy Loaded Pockets

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    Yea, thanks for all of the detailed explanations. I also have found that I dont particularly like purchasing from 3rd party vendors on Amazon. If there is a problem with a product from a third party distributor one would have to contact them directly and sort of grovel a bit in order to get a refund or replacement.

    99% of the time I only purchase from " ships from and sold by Amazon?"

    When purchasing watches from Amazon I noticed that they provide their own warranty which sometimes would have outlasted the manufacturer warranty.
     
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  16. tirod

    tirod Loaded Pockets

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    When I purchased my G Shock two things came to mind - that the counterfeits were for popular watches. My choice wasn't a common widely available module. Second, the vendor is who you are buying. I picked one with a large footprint of items for sale which meant they had likely more than just a guy working out of his garage or whatever. It's hard to track 1,100 items for sale, and package and ship them from a site in America. It takes staff and a serious commitment to keep the business going over the long haul, not just jump in with a few questionable items of merchandise to disappear later.

    It didn't hurt to find them on ebay, too, and then surf to locate they have their own web page selling direct to the public. That at least means they have had some dealings with more than just one "front page" web site and are less likely to blow a good reputation on selling trash.

    Bought the watch and it came two days early. First rate packaging and all the manuals and tags, which are also part of the indicators the watch is genuine. Fakers don't care to spend money on every little thing to make their copy look real. It also helps to see the details of the watch if you can get their photos not ad copy. G Shocks use a particular screw to assemble them, and there are other tells which research and study will discover belong to a specific model. Knowing all that first is how you not only pick a vendor of genuine merchandise but also how to tell when you get a fake - which is better than years later when it needs service and then you discover it. Ask some Rolex buyers who got grey market out of the Orient bout that.

    I found Amazon to be more trustworthy about original goods, but the price is about 5% higher, a decent premium for the assurance compared to ebay, where I have been fleeced for over $150 thru the years with no resolution. Just remember that if the price seems to good to be true . . .