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Discussion in 'General EDC Discussion' started by Osage, Jun 3, 2020.

  1. Osage

    Osage Loaded Pockets

    May 15, 2012
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    Traditionally the “bug-out-bag” has been designed for wilderness survival. During the last few months, I have been rethinking my BOB with more of an urban/suburban focus.

    Imagine a scenario where there are mass riots all across the US, and, in particular, the city where you live. For whatever reason, you have to navigate this chaotic urban environment and cover quite a distance, on foot, to get to a specific location. Your best estimate is it will take you 2-3 days to traverse the chaos.

    A lot of what you will come across is unknown. However, time is of the essence, and you have to move as quickly as possible. This limits the amount of gear you are going to be able to take.

    Areas of Focus
    There are four core areas I am going to focus. They are:
    1. Essentials
    2. Security
    3. Navigation
    4. Communication

    I’m going to try my best to categorize the gear choices into one of twelve “systems.” Feel free to comment, critique, and make alternative suggestions. Here we go--

    Tool System
    • MultiTool, e.g., Leatherman Wave +
    • Small pry bar, e.g., Piranha tool
    • Folding knife, e.g., Benchmade Triage
    • Fixed blade knife, e.g., Winkler SAR knife
    • Small bolt cutter, e.g., Knipex 8 or 6 inch
    • Sillcock wrench (for urban water procurement)
    • Knife sharpener
    • Lock pick set
    • Wire saw
    • Paracord
    • Gorilla tape
    • Carabiner
    • Rubber bands
    • Compass
    • Headlamp
    • Small flashlight
    • 4 medium & 4 large zip ties

    Electronic System
    • Battery, USB, Anker
    • Charger, AA Battery, Goal Zero and 4 GZ AA batteries
    • 4 Nicad AA & AAA batteries
    • Solar Panel, Goal Zero Nomad 7 +

    Communication System
    • Smartphone, e.g. iPhone & charger
    • iCom ID 51 & charger-Handheld HAM radio
    • SatPhone & charger & modem
    • SW/AM/FM radio-small handheld

    Computer System
    • Mini iPad & charger
    • WiFi thumb drive

    Cooking System
    • Titanium cookset & spork, e.g. Snowpeak
    • Lighter/matches

    Water System
    • 2-1 quart canteen
    • Sawyer straw

    Sleep System
    • Bivy bag & tarp/ground cloth
    • Poncho

    Medical System
    • FAK
     4 adhesive bandages
     2-2-pack ibuprofen
     Imodium AD
     2-2-pack aspirin
     ½ roll medical tape
     4 surgical sponges
     3 antiseptic wipes
     4 butterfly bandages
     2 packs antibiotic salve
     Tweezers
     4 safety pins
     4 5 by 3 1/8 inch sheet moleskin
     2 Aqua Mira water treatment tabs
     Sawyer water filter kit
     Tourniquet
     Emergency trauma bandages
     Hemostatic agents

    Clothing System
    • 1 underwear
    • 2 socks

    Shelter System
    • See sleep system

    Personal/Hygiene System
    • Personal Dopp kit
     Toothbrush
     Toothpaste
     Dental floss
     Soap
     Hand sanitizer
     Bug spray
     Sunscreen
     Small travel towel
     TP
     Ear plugs

    Weapon System
    • Handgun, e.g., Barretta 9mm pistol, holster, clip holders & clips

    On person & in pockets (all the rest is in a "greyman" backpack)
     PPE Facemask & Nitrile gloves
     iPhone
     Earplugs
     Folding knife
     Lighter
     Survival key chain (2)
     Car keys
     Hand cleaner
     Garmin watch & Sinn Watch
     Notebook/space pen & Combat pen
     Sunglasses
     Multi-tool
     Winkler SAR knife
     First aid/survival kit
     Wallet
     ICOM radio
     SAT phone
     Money

    Analyzing the above with traditional wilderness BOBs I note the absence of a sleeping bag, sleeping pad, tent, & food. I also note an increase in tools. Question: Is there too much redundancy in Comm? Do I need the iPad mini or the small solar panel? Weight and mobility is always a crucial factor. What do you think??
    Last edited by Osage, Jun 3, 2020
    #1 Osage, Jun 3, 2020
    Last edited: Jun 3, 2020
  2. EZDog

    EZDog EDC Junkie!!!!!

    Dec 3, 2012
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    Oh Brother!

    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
  3. tera tike

    tera tike Loaded Pockets

    Jan 8, 2013
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    As with any traveling, weight is your enemy, lighter your are, the faster you can move.

    Ditch the Small bolt cutter, it can not cut padlocks and the Leatherman Wave + can cut fencing if needed, just not as efficient.
    Urban environment, larger pry bar will be useful for beaching buildings.

    Wire saw???

    Change the Headlamp to a micro light as a backup....I like headlamps for work and leisure but in time of crises I think they are more a risk.
    People tend to look up when they hear noise which can compromise you.

    Who are you communicating with? What comms do they have and are capable of using?

    Garmin and Sinn Watch, pick one but not both.

    A Bivy bag? In higher population density areas someone is always watching, having to put yourself in a bag is more of a risk in my opinion.
    I would use the tarp with water resistant hoodie and rain pants bloused to sleep in, this will also give a double use.

    Try to have all the electronics that use replaceable batteries be of the same type. Less and lighter, faster.
    Find a battery charger that could double as a battery bank.

    Combine Mini iPad charger, smartphone, SW/AM/FM radio and if possible Sat-phone charger as one.

    Ditch the solar, it will take a minimum of 4 times the time to charge a item then if charging with mains. They are great for base camps.

    Cooking system... What are you cooking street cats and rats? Just kidding. Why no food packs / energy bars?
    I would loose the titanium cook-set but keep the spork and add a P38 can opener.

    Two Sawyer water filters? I would just keep one.
    For water filters I prefer the Grayl water filter, it is easier to filter when tired or ill, and could replace one of the canteens.
    I would go with a flexible water hydration bladder in the backpack instead of the canteen.

    I prefer alcohol wipes over antiseptic wipes, as they can be used for many things.

    I would add a extra shirt to the clothing system.

    Tether all small items to keep from loosing or forgetting items when moving.

    All of the comments above are my thoughts and in no regard considered expert advice.
    Fishin Fool and Moshe ben David like this.
  4. SOS24

    SOS24 Loaded Pockets

    Feb 12, 2016
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    I have considered urban vs standard set-ups for emergency preparedness as well on a few occasions and think a lot on your list is pretty good. My main question is if this is a BOB or more of a GHB. I ask because if it is just suppose to be for a 2-3 traverse of an urban area to a location where you will have what you need, then I do think it is a little overboard but that may be just be me, who would rather lean on lighter and faster. Also, is this a bag you plan on carrying everyday in an urban environment or just leave stored in a car for if needed, because that may change what is desired.

    Here are a few of my thoughts, considering some of what you list:
    - A paper city map should be top on your list. A paper map allows you to plan routes and alternates, as well as mark areas to avoid based off available information. You can see places to get resources or shelter along the way.
    - In an urban environment, carrying a large fixed blade knife could get you in trouble. I lean more towards a breacher bar/tool or mini fireman tool that would appear more as a tool than a weapon. If intending as a weapon and not concerned about laws then go with fixed blade knife.
    - Again if planning on carrying, you need to be cognizant of laws as far as lock picks. If not a licensed dealer, carrying lock picks in some states and cities is illegal.
    - Depending on event planning for and time period, for 2-3 days, I would probably forego sillcock wrench due to weight vs need. Unless in a seasonal area in offseason, you should be able to find sufficient locations with running water without need of a sillcock wrench.
    - I would probably forego bolt cutters. Bolt cutters are another tool similar to lock pick set that could get you in trouble in some areas unless required for work. Plus unless you have a specific use/location in mind, I’m not sure of the weight vs advantage. Between prybar and multitool you could probably gain access to many places without needing to rely on access to an area requiring bolt cutters.
    - I don’t really see a need for a saw in an urban environment, especially considering most multitools have one.
    - Instead of canteens, I would more lean towards1-2 collapsible water bags. They are much lighter and smaller. Also, the Sawyer filter, if carry, easily screws on some.
    - As far as filter, I might just go with a small dropper bottle of bleach instead of a water filter. In a city there is a good chance clean water can easily be obtained and if not a couple drops of bleach takes care of it so 15ml vial would be plenty for 2-3 days
    - I would probably pass over a full cook-set and stick to jerky, nutrition bars, etc that can bee eaten on the go. Even a USCG survival bar should be sufficient for a couple days in an urban environment where other food could be scrounged if needed. At most, I would go with a small esbit stove and metal cup to heat something up if during winter if necessary.
    - If you have a smartphone, I think a tablet and thumb drive are needed if just trying to get from A to B.
    - For comms, unless I had an additional need for a SAT phone, I would probably forego it because of the cost, weight and size. I think a phone, HAM radio (which most can receive radio channels) and/or handheld scanner would be sufficient. Especially in case of civil unrest you will find out more via Local HAM emergency channels or monitoring scanner faster than you would via the radio anyway.
    -As far as power, probably lean more towards carrying extra set of battery and a battery pack that could charge phone and HAM battery and charging cords. In an urban environment, unless you are expecting the “event” to take out electricity, you should be able to access it so charging cables and a spare set of batteries where possible should be sufficient. With judicious use, except the phone, you may be able to make devices last 2-3 days without charging. If wanting to leaning on side of caution, then you could have a battery pack with folding solar panel not much larger then many cell phones that would be sufficient.
    - Instead of headlamp and flashlight, I would go with a flashlight and have a head strap that I could attach to if desired.
    - Have a red (or other color filter) and diffuser for flashlight. Colored light is not as visible to others so it would be less conspicuous.
    - As far as sleep system, unless winter, I would probably just lean towards an emergency bivy or a small waterproof blanket. It is fairly easy to find shelter from elements in an urban environment, so a blanket or bivy could provide sufficient protection. I would also have a poncho or contractor garbage bag for walking/gear protection that could help a little if required.
    - Cash is definitely something to have divided up and stored in various locations on body and various denominations.

    Keeping things small, light and inconspicuous is the key to maneuvering quickly in an urban environment. The weight being carried and ability to move could easily be the difference between 2 and 3 days. Therefore, in some cases I think having less would be a bigger advantage.
    #4 SOS24, Jun 3, 2020
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2020
    aicolainen and Moshe ben David like this.
  5. jcombs

    jcombs Loaded Pockets

    Jan 31, 2016
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    As I was reading your post, I thought this is nuts, no one carries this much stuff.

    Then I got to your lists and realize that I have most everything you listed either in my truck bag or my EDC bag with a few exceptions.
    aicolainen likes this.
  6. ffmedic245

    ffmedic245 Loaded Pockets

    Jul 16, 2014
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    Just like packing for a vacation, lay out all your stuff and rethink everything. Do I REALLY need this, or just want it? For a 2-3 day travel, you don't need to double and triple up on things.
    kikaida and Moshe ben David like this.
  7. Sentinel-14

    Sentinel-14 Loaded Pockets

    Oct 7, 2019
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    First things first: you need to define what you're trying to accomplish and what you expect the bag to do for you. Much of your toolset sounds like "long-term urban survival" rather than "bugging out". Of course, your definitions might be different than mine, which is why we need to establish them up front.

    Next, 'bug-out-bags' are not necessarily designed for wilderness survival: they're designed to be self-contained kits you can live out of when you don't have access to the rest of your supplies, or so I understand it. One might live out of a bug-out bag while sitting in a FEMA camp after a natural disaster. Maybe your house got damaged by a storm and you're living in a tent in the back yard, cooking food in your billy can even though you live in the suburbs. The point is, you pack your bag based on what you want it to do for you. For some, it's certainly backwoods wilderness escape. For others, a bug-out bag can simply be 3 days of supplies for survival in an urban environment away from home.

    Next, if I'm 'bugging out' then I sure as heck am not staying in the city. To me the whole point is to get away from large concentrations of people. As I said much of what you have listed sounds more like long-term post-apocalyptic urban survival, and I have to ask myself.... what city do you live in where you're expecting to be living out of this bag for 2-3 days? My city's not large, certainly, maybe 5 miles E-W and 7 miles N-S, but I can cover that in a day just walking. Further, any urban kit should be designed with a singular goal in mind: get you home quickly and safely. Most of your gear is at home, including your bigger and more specialized gear, and it's safer being at home than out on foot. If you're already at home, why are you leaving? Bugging In is almost always better than bugging out; bugging out just makes you a slightly-better-prepared refugee. Help us out by telling us the relative size of the area you're expecting to operate in so people can give more tailored answers. If you tell me you want to build an urban BOB for LA or NYC, I'm bowing out: I don't know enough about cities that large to give appropriate suggestions. I just stay away from them.

    If a lot of what you will come across is unknown, I have to ask Why? Are you not familiar with the city you're in? Do you not know the streets, the bad areas, where the stores are, etc? Again, my city isn't all that large (pop. ~160,000) but I know the streets well enough to navigate. I know the bad areas of town to avoid, I know where the stores are... It's sounding to me like you're wanting commentary on a loadout designed around a much larger city than I would have advice for, which goes back to you needing to better define your area of operation in order to get more appropriate commentary.

    But, these are my thoughts:

    no need for the fixed blade in an urban environment unless your expecting to need it as a weapon. Urban cutting can be handled just fine with a folder.
    ditch the bolt cutters: as has been said they're not going to cut locks and you can cut chainlink fence with the Leatherman if you have to.
    ditch the sillcock key. If you approach a building where you could use one, just go inside and refill. If you can't go inside, it probably isn't safe to approach the building anyway.
    ditch the knife sharpener: no need for one if you're just planning on a 2-3 day trek.
    what purpose does the wire saw serve? first, I've never seen one that didn't suck, and second I cant think of a need for one in an urban environment.
    make sure your carabiner is climbing rated so that you know it can take some weight.
    ditch the small flashlight. You only need one good light, and in most cases (urban and wilderness) you want both hands free. You can always use a headlamp as a handheld if you need to.

    I'm going to combine commentary on Electronics, Comms and Computer because to me they're intertwined.

    for a 2-3 day stint, what's the point of the HAM? Most emergency personnel use digital radios these days so the HAM wont pick up their transmissions.
    why a satellite phone? if cell service is out you have bigger problems
    I dont see a purpose for the iPad that your smartphone doesn't already serve, so I'd ditch it.
    given that I'd ditch all this stuff, I dont see much need for any of your charging kit other than the solar panel and a single usb battery like the anker. Alternatively, some batteries have solar built right onto them, which would eliminate the need for the panel thus saving you bulk and weight.

    For a 2-3 day stint I see no need for a cooking kit. Get rid of it and pack some food bars so that you can eat on the move. You did say time was of the essence, so stopping to eat should be avoided if possible.

    ditch the bivy bag: a tarp and poncho are all you need for this duration.

    No commentary on medical: seems good to go and everyone builds their kit to suit their own ends. I'd add some rolled gauze though, personally.

    I'm going to be the pedant here because no one else has yet: it's magazine, not clip. Some weapons like the Garand and Carcano rifles take clips, but not the Beretta: it uses Magazines. Words mean things so let's use them appropriately. ;)
    (just yankin your chain here, no offense intended. But, improper word use is a peeve of mine...)

    For your situation I suggest a minimum of 2 spare magazines of 15-round capacity or greater; 4 would be better. I think Berettas (I assume you're meaning a 92 or M9) can take up to an 18-round mag and still be flush with the bottom of the grip, so I'd go that route if you can. Avoid extended mags as they'll throw off the balance of the weapon in your hand, making it harder to employ accurately. Unless you practice with extended mags a lot and can hit what you're aiming at, in which case get the highest-cap mags you can get your hands on. Local laws should be followed when possible, so if you're legally limited on mag capacity then of course stay within the limit.

    Your on-person list gets modified a bit based on my earlier commentary, mainly in that you won't have Winkler, Sat phone or Ham on you. Make sure you have a proper belt to hold the weight of your weapon and mags; a typical dress belt isn't going to do it. Even if you dont intend to open carry you need to have the capability to do so should the need arise. Having the weapon in your bag wont do you much good if you need it quickly, and if you have an improper belt it's just going to drag your pants down, slowing your overall movement as you try to hold your pants up. Get a good belt and you wont have to deal with that issue. 5.11 Operator belts are pretty decent and not expensive, but there are dozens of options if you look. Get one to suit your needs and taste. Also, make sure your footwear is appropriate for long-term walking; trying to cross a city in loafers is going to be hell on your feet. Good walking shoes or boots with good inserts are what you should have.

    I may be off the mark here in places, but until you better define your area (both starting and ending), and what exactly you're wanting from the kit, it's going to be hard to provide more focused commentary. As you better define these things my commentary will likely change.
  8. echo victor

    echo victor Previously "YankeeHotelFoxtrot"

    Mar 16, 2010
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    Sentinel, re the HAM radio, I thought about what you wrote. I would say that, while you may not be able to talk directly to some Emergency Personnel, you could very well reach ARES and/or RACES, which could deal with, or relay, any problems that might arise. Sometimes just getting to a repeater might enable one to talk to another HAM, who could then relay the message..

  9. dmattaponi

    dmattaponi Loaded Pockets

    May 1, 2010
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    I remember when I was in full edc forum mode. It’s fun for a while, but then It gets old and sooner or later you wind up, maybe with a pocket knife, and small flashlight, a pen...drawers and closets full of unused edc gear...and finally a little contentment :). Even then, you may occasionally fall off the wagon, but you quickly jump back on and proceed from there.

    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
    #9 dmattaponi, Jun 5, 2020
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2020
    kikaida, Archive, Fishin Fool and 4 others like this.
  10. Sentinel-14

    Sentinel-14 Loaded Pockets

    Oct 7, 2019
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    I understand that, and I have a portable HAM radio for emergency purposes. But, I spend a good deal of time in rural areas where cell coverage isn't great and having that capability could be life-saving. In an urban environ, as we're discussing here, I dont see a need for it outside of major disaster or collapse. That's why I'm asking the OP to get more specific about what the bag is for, what his area of operation is, and what he's expecting to get out of it. Until then we're just talking about a random collection of gear.

    If he's urban he should be focused on getting home and staying home, or if home is compromised then he should be focused on getting to the nearest first-response deployment site. In either case, a scanner would go further to help him find them than a HAM that cant pick up their signals.

    I've re-read the OP to drill down into this some more, and see I missed an important point. This is why I shouldn't post at work. :p

    I've bolded the important parts. Mass Rioting redefines the scope of what this bag is meant to do, and having to move through the chaos on foot narrows what can be packed around, with a 2-3 day window of activity. I'm trying to put myself in your shoes and figure out the situation you're thinking about but we're still missing the critical information of 'where are you going?' If you're staying in the city (moving through the riots from one location to another) that requires different gear than moving through the riotous city and out into rural safety. Since you include a silcock key I assume your intent is to stay in the city, in which case much of my previous commentary stands. If your intent is to escape the city and head for rural safety, then calls for a very different gear loadout.

    Regardless, either situation is difficult for me to imagine because it goes against several things I consider 'common sense,' the first of which is that it is always safer to stay home than be out on foot, even if you're walking out of the riots to relative safety. You can much more easily defend yourself from inside your home, and if the rioters come there you put them down with lethal effectiveness. After the first few drop, the message becomes clear. "Go Away."

    [edit: I want to make it clear that I do not advocate use of lethal force unless absolutely necessary. All efforts to diffuse and de-escalate should be made first.]

    Second, if you leave home you only have the supplies in your bag. Stay home and you have so much more (assuming you have prepared properly and dont have to go to the store every day.)

    Bugging out just doesn't make sense unless there is just no possible way to stay home. IF you tell me a hurricane or tornado is headed to my house and will level it, then yeah... I'll bug out. But if my home is standing, I'm bunkering in.
    Last edited by Sentinel-14, Jun 5, 2020
    #10 Sentinel-14, Jun 5, 2020
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2020
  11. ballistic

    ballistic Loaded Pockets

    Dec 27, 2007
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    Scenario described is more of and urban E&E scenario. Light=fast as others have said. Focus on fitness, speed, and smarts and go as far as fast as possible, don't stop moving until you're clear of area of find places to shelter and hide if it's to dangerous to move, then start moving again as soon as you can. Minimal set of gear to keep yourself hydrated, fueled, healthy, able to navigate, and protected from the elements. In all but extreme environments that means what you're already wearing You should already have a plan with contingencies and be able to mentally adapt under the stress.

    In all but the largest urban areas like LA, we're talking hours not days.

    Not sure what your scenario entails? Do you live in the city or visiting? Are you just trying to escape a city on foot during riots? What is your ultimate destination? Are you meeting someone that you're separated from at pre-designated rallying point according to an action-plan? Who are you communicating with?
    Last edited by ballistic, Jun 5, 2020
    #11 ballistic, Jun 5, 2020
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2020
    jbj and Sentinel-14 like this.
  12. ballistic

    ballistic Loaded Pockets

    Dec 27, 2007
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    I'd add to the OP you might want to consider attending a GoRuck Constellation event (Packing List) once they start up again if you're in CONUS.

    Depending on your local laws, you'd be better off with a pair of Bogata picks and the ability to use them proficiently than a pair of bolt cutters..
    #12 ballistic, Jun 5, 2020
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2020
  13. echo victor

    echo victor Previously "YankeeHotelFoxtrot"

    Mar 16, 2010
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    Sentinel - I understand. My comment addressed only the specific point of being able to contact some form of emergency services. And, hopefully, Emergency services would be using a repeater, else it would be pointless for them to utilize HAM equipment at all.

    I think you've covered this topic comprehensively and thoughtfully. Nice work.
  14. Osage

    Osage Loaded Pockets

    May 15, 2012
    Likes Received:

    Thanks for your responses and critiques. I am reading and re-reading them all and have already been making changes and alterations. There is nothing like "peer review" to make you think and rethink. Thanks once again and keep them coming...
  15. aicolainen

    aicolainen Loaded Pockets

    Jan 7, 2017
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    It seems to be an increasing interest in BOBs these days, with corona and riots, and more people than usual asks for advice and review of their BOBs , but generally leaves out the most important info: what are you expecting the bag to do for you? How far are you going, in what terrain, what climate, are you alone or do you have responsibility for other persons than yourself, possibilities for re-supply along the way etc. Without this info, there is really no way to give good advice.

    The scenario you describe, all tough limited, is quite far fetched for me. Maybe it shouldn’t be, and maybe it was far fetched for many US residents a few weeks ago, too.
    It’s not easy commenting on something that is far fetched, but as others have mentioned my priorities would also be to:
    1: get out of the city
    2: find my way home*
    *)In the event that your home is compromised, replace home with a known safe place, e.g. relatives, a friends house or a cabin/lodge or other secondary property you own or have access to.

    The nitty gritty of that list dictates that even though there could be obstacles in the city delaying your retreat and adding some items to your packing list, to help you overcome those challenges, I would not totally abandon items that will benefit your survival in rural areas.
    Actually I would go so far as to say this scenario we see now with riots, looting and unprovoked violence is THE time to get out into the woods/backcountry if needed. In most other scenarios I consider this a counterproductive approach that doesn't make sense unless you're a wannabe prepper with a youtube channel. Now, based on what I see in the media (for whatever that’s worth), it makes perfect sense to go off track. It's a much harder journey in most cases, but overall I think it would be safer.
    Focus on what you know you’ll be needing. Food, water and protection from the elements are your basic needs. Must have. Everything on top of that are just in case items.
    Tool system: This ain’t a camping trip. I would ditch everything in your tool system except multitool, paracord and a headlamp. If you can’t fix it with a multitool, move on.
    Electronics, comms and computer, I would ditch everything except smartphone, a high capacity power bank and a wall charger.
    Cooking system: a warm cup of coffee is great for boosting moral. A single walled steel or titanium mug and something to start a fire is all you need for that if the opportunity present its self.
    Water system: I would probably replace those canteens with a PET or Nalgene bottle and a water bladder. The bladder is very space effective, while the bottle provides an easier alternative for filling or drinking in certain situations.
    Sleep system: from your existing system I’m guessing that climate is not much of a challenge where you live, I would still go with a super light 1-person tent. Completely rain and bug proof. Enough space to comfortably prepare a meal, check your gear or treat yourself for possible wounds or injuries, while still being very light and compact in your pack.
    Medical system seems very extensive as well, but I won’t give advice on where to reduce.
    Clothing system: unlike your other systems, this seems a little underwhelming. Maybe because I live in a harsh climate, but really, no matter where you live, your clothing system is an integral part of your PPE. From the media coverage fires and pollution seems to be extensive in certain areas. I would make sure my clothing system consisted of materials that are fire retardant and somewhat able to withstand chemicals, e.g. cotton, wool, leather and Nomex (I always live by this «rule», unless I’m in an outdoor situation). Make sure that you are able to cover your whole body in this kind of clothing if neccessary and have redundancy for important items like gloves that easily gets damaged or lost. Supplement with some kind of super light rain-gear and insulation layer according to climate and season.
    Personal/hygiene: again, it’s not camping. Be deliberate and cut back on anything you can do without a coupe of days. Personally I can become mentally ill unless I can brush my teeth with a certain interval, so a toothbrush and small tube of tooth paste is certainly a must have in my book. Dental floss? that can wait. The rest is pretty OK, I guess. Just make sure to get consumables in appropriate sizes. Travel towel is really a luxury item. If you need/or get the chance to clean up, use a shirt or some other absorbent item that can serve as dual use. Hang it outside your pack to dry as you move along.
    Weapon system, again it’s not for me to comment on. Whatever your trained and comfortable with. That said, to keep with your grey-man/move fast philosophy, whatever you carry should not print, restrict your movement or cause abrasion on you skin.
    On person: seems to be a combination of items already listed above and some new new items. Items on this list I’ll ditch, even if it’s mentioned above or not; folding knife, survival key chain, one of the watches (the one you don’t usually wear), SAR knife, ICOM radio and SAT phone. What you actually wear on your body is a personal choice, but try to avoid stuffed pockets and printing / open carry of objects that might get you unwanted attention and go against your grey-man philosophy.

    To sum it up, the more «what if’s» you want to prepare for, the heavier your pack, the slower you move and maybe even attract more attention - which again might introduce even new challenges you wish to prepare for. The packing list can easily spiral out of proportion when you get into that line of thinking. It’s important to prepare mentally and visualize possible scenarios in advance, but you can’t prepare for everything.
    echo victor and jcombs like this.
  16. BadExample

    BadExample Loaded Pockets

    Apr 27, 2014
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    Dude you have 4 knives and 2 multitools in that list - but zero tinder, nothing to insulate yourself from the ground, no ways to signal for help or rescue and completely not enough water containers unless you rely on water being readily awailable to you.

    No offense but I'm going to assume you didn't try this kit out and actually walked a couple of days outdoors with it. You really really really should.
    Moshe ben David likes this.
  17. Osage

    Osage Loaded Pockets

    May 15, 2012
    Likes Received:
    BadExample wrote "Dude you have 4 knives and 2 multitools in that list - but zero tinder, nothing to insulate yourself from the ground, no ways to signal for help or rescue and completely not enough water containers unless you rely on water being readily awailable to you.

    No offense but I'm going to assume you didn't try this kit out and actually walked a couple of days outdoors with it. You really really really should."

    Thank you for your critique BadExample.

    BTW could you provide a list of what you would want to have on your person given the scenario; I would be very interested in reading it.
    BadExample likes this.
  18. BadExample

    BadExample Loaded Pockets

    Apr 27, 2014
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    I don't have an urban BOB, but I have an urban GHB (I work literally 20 minutes of slow walk from home) and a general BOB.

    Due to the urban theme of this thread I'll talk about my GHB:

    My main survival gear cache is a maxpedition fatty with the following gear, divided into these categories -

    - Space blanket
    - Heating block (I don't know how they're called in English, it's these chemical square thingsies that keep you warm and cozy)
    - A bandana
    - A large garbage bag that I can use for either shelter or (more importantl in an urban setting) for insulation.

    - I have a block of fatwood - my favorite source of tinder
    - A lighter, wrapped in duct tape (which can also be used for tinder)
    - Firesteel with a magnezium block + striker and ranger band (which burns like crazy!)
    - and last but not least a small flat box of hotel matches

    - Leatherman Wave, with s30v blade... because edge retention is awesomesauce
    - Fallkniven sharpenning stone... because dull blades are the opposite of awesomesauce

    - Compass
    - Notepad
    - Sharpie

    - Rope - I didn't go for paracord because it is too thick and takes too much space. Went with thinner rope, I'm not about to rappell with it.
    - A heavy duty carabiner
    - Zipties

    - Sawyer mini filter
    - Sillock key, or whatever they're called
    - One condom, for both an improvised water container and for if I meet a lovely lady that my wife will never find about

    - Whistle
    - Mirror (can also be used for 1st aid)

    - Sticklight
    - (Flashlight currently got lost so I'm waiting for a new one to come, but... flashlight!)

    1st AID:
    - Small booboo kit
    - Israeli bandage
    - Moleskin
    - Pain killers
    - Heat relievers or whatever they're called

    - Sewing kit
    - Safety pins (can also be used for 1st aid)
    - Dental floss (can also be used for 1st aid and hygiene)

    On top of that I carry in my backpack
    - Single walled Klean Kanteen - that will carry me water and allow me to boil it if needed
    - Map of the area I live in
    - A proper 1st aid kit, bigger than the booboo kit in the maxpedition
    - Pepper spray (most effective vs dogs and other nose-sensitive animals)
    - Some high calory low cost food - it's not exactly an energy bar, it's like this sweet snack with lots of sugar fruits and nuts. It's not super tasty but it will refill them energies for the walk home.

    On myself for EDC I usually carry a folding knife (Spyderco Paramilitary 2 is by far my favorite amongst what I own) , a good paracord bracelet with extra twine that can be used for tinder, a tactical pen, and even though I do not smoke I am enough of a pyromaniac to always carry a lighter.

    I went out with this setup to test it out and managed to be just fine after the first overnight outdoors, which included a rather long hike and a lot of fire starting not to freeze outdoors. (I was too cheap to open the space blanket. Yes, I know they cost like... 2 bucks.)
    echo victor and Moshe ben David like this.
  19. Osage

    Osage Loaded Pockets

    May 15, 2012
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    Thanks to all who responded.

    To expand upon my scenario I live in an area that has all three basic environments-urban, suburban, and rural. I used as my working example a situation where I was in one neighboring city and had to travel to my home town that was 35 miles away if one drove on the interstate. This course lies primarily in urban and suburban venues, some of which are very industrial and not particularly "safe". Likewise, I would have to cross one major river.

    An alternative route would be to take a dogleg course which would avoid a significant amount of urban area and include much more rural areas, which under certain circumstances might be much less dangerous. (It would still necessitate crossing a major river.) However, it would also increase the distance traveled to 54 miles.

    Frankly, I found this thought problem quite entertaining since all my life I have been oriented to focusing on the "wild" outdoors.

    In any case, having seriously considered everything suggested (even the "Oh brother" remark which I took to mean meant "hey, fella, you must have way too much time on your hands" which given this pandemic is an accurate and insightful comment) the following is my most current list--

    Tool System
    · MultiTool, e.g., Leatherman Charge +
    · Piranha tool (or any similar tool)
    · Knipex bolt cutter
    · Breacher bar, 8 ½ inch
    · Sillcock wrench (for urban water procurement)
    · Fixed blade knife, e.g., Winkler SAR knife
    · Lock pick set
    · Paracord
    · Bank cord
    · Gorilla tape
    · Carabiner, locking
    · Rubber bands
    · Compass
    · Headlamp
    · Small flashlight
    · 4 medium & 4 large zip ties

    Electronic System
    · Battery, USB, Anker
    · Charger, AA Battery, Goal Zero and 4 GZ AA batteries
    · 4 Nicad AA & AAA batteries

    Communication System
    · Smartphone, e.g. iPhone & charger
    · SatPhone & charger (back-up if cell towers are down)
    · SW/AM/FM radio-small handheld
    · Earphones, small, portable

    Cooking System
    · Stainless steel water bottle & cup with lid, e.g. Pathfinder (multi-use as a water bottle)
    · Wire holder (used with the water bottle & cup)
    · Spoon or spork
    · Lighter/matches

    Water System
    · 2-water bottles (see cooking system & Grayl bottle)
    · Grayl bottle

    Sleep System
    · Tarp/ground cloth
    · Bivy (sleep on top of if not safe to sleep inside of)
    · SOL survival blanket in colder weather
    · Poncho & 5 TI tent stakes

    Medical System
    · FAK (Same as OP)

    Clothing System
    · 1 underwear
    · 2 socks
    · Bandana

    Shelter System
    · See sleep system

    Personal/Hygiene System
    · Personal Dopp kit
    Dental floss (multi-use as repair thread)
    Hand sanitizer
    Bug spray
    2 large sewing needles
    PPE Facemask & Nitrile gloves​

    Weapon System
    Personal preference​

    It all fits in a medium-sized hiking pack, is not too heavy, and with a hiking pole in my hand, I haven't caused too much stir as I tramp around my area trying it out. And no the LEOs haven't yet stopped me, but if they do I will just tell the truth--I'm just getting in shape for a 54-mile hike.
  20. Boudreaux

    Boudreaux Loaded Pockets

    Aug 9, 2013
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    My .02 cents, You have a lot of stuff for 2-3 days, especially for an urban environment.

    I work in highly metropolitan area of about 1 million people, I live about 30 miles from work. So this is something that I have building into my EDC bag. I am looking at it more from the Escape and Evade perspective. There is a lot of resources in an urban environment, utilize what is there before carrying extra gear.

    I would put your tool system on a major diet, Single multi tool, if that doesn't solve it move on or around.
    Sillcocks key this is one thing I would not ditch, you can get water from just about anywhere with one. Yes you can go in a store or where ever to get water, but why risk it, when you can get water from the outside of a building?
    I would get one small light with a reverse clip that can be used as a hand held light or on a hat and hands free, also consider a glow stick.

    Electronics, Spare battery for light and battery pack for a phone.

    Coms, stick with the phone/ipad, headphones

    Cook system, its two or three days... You need a water bottle and some basic food. Save the weight.

    Sleep System, there is a lot of place to utilize shelter in an urban environment, use them.

    IFAK, remember, its 2-3 days, protect yourself against the things that will kill you by then or take you out of the fight. Add eye drop/flush, can't make it far without being able to see.

    Clothing, one pair of extra socks if you wear crappy socks everyday.

    Personal hygiene, again, its 2-3 days suck it up.

    Urban areas are a lot of doors and windows, you should be able to gain entry and prevent entry to them. Another thing to consider is that a lot of these doors are auto locking/RFID/ controlled access behind you, so if you need to return to the door you need to make sure that it stays open. Lock picks are good, but they take time, consider bypassing locks as a quicker option. Things like bump keys, shims and bypass tools they can be quick and effective.
    ran23, JIM and echo victor like this.