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Reality of carrying.

Discussion in 'Handguns' started by jackknife, Sep 16, 2017.

  1. jag-engr
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    jag-engr Semper Bufo!
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    That's not quite correct. I imagine that you are thinking of this FBI report that indicates that you are more likely to be struck by lightning than killed in a mass shooting. Mass shooting are a tiny fraction of gun violence in the US.

    There are around 50 lightning strikes a year in the US and about 80,000 shootings. Granted, about 80% of the shooting are gang-related. Even considering only 20% of the shootings (16,000), you are still 320 times more likely to be shot than hit by lightning.
     
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  2. charlie fox

    charlie fox Loaded Pockets

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    I never took a threat personally, but I never discounted them either. I have had a huge shift in what, when and how I carry over the last 18 since leaving LE, but I always carry something all the time. Like insurance or a fire extinguisher; it’s better to have it and not need it then to need it and not have it. It took a few years and a move across country to make me realize that I don’t do stupid stuff with stupid people in stupid places anymore, so my G19 stays in the safe and my LCP gets the nod most days.
     
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  3. kukla

    kukla Loaded Pockets

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    Urban or rural, modern day thugs will kill or assault you for a nickel (or nothing at all in many cases).
    Though I haven't been in an accident in over 50 years, i still drive carefully and wear a seat belt.
    Though I've never had a fire in my house, kitchen, garage, etc, I still keep fire extinguishers on hand.
    Though the overall likelihood of being attacked or assaulted is small, there are many regions where these crimes are rampant.
    I'm glad that you feel confident where you are, go, and stay, but many people can't duplicate being recognized as a person to respect & avoid.
    To second-guess whether to go armed or not could put one into a genuine "kick myself in the posterior" situation, with all the trimmings that go along with that.
    I'd tolerate the discomfort or logistics otherwise.
    ........I think of all the law abiding citizens, who, due to their state & local laws, don't even have the option.

    THAT in itself, is a crime.
     
  4. huntnow

    huntnow Loaded Pockets

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    I have insurance on lots of property. The most important property, my family, has an added layer of protection, me. I agree with wanderer16, the chances of me needing my weapon are not good, if that is the right way to put it. I also agree with patientcero who probably spent 5 minutes finding examples of the need for self protection. I choose to exercise my rights, responsibly.
     
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  5. Telstar

    Telstar Loaded Pockets

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    That's just silly.. plain ole common sense easily rebuts that proclamation.
     
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  6. jag-engr
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    jag-engr Semper Bufo!
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    As do statistics.
     
  7. SOS24
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    SOS24 Loaded Pockets

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    I would really like to know from where you are getting your statistics, because from the ones I find lightening strikes are nowhere even close to violent crime.

    Bureau of Justice Statistics reports 1,248,480 injuries from violent crimes (4.6 per 1000 people) for 2017, although this is based on surveys. Just using the FBI data for 2016, there were 1,248,185 violent crimes committed in the US with 803,007 being aggravated assaults and 17,250 murders.

    The lightening strike numbers were harder to find, but I did find some. One article I read, estimated 24,000 deaths and 240,000 injuries a year from lightning strikes for worldwide. The CDC gave the odds as 1 in 500,000 per year of being struck by lightening in US.

    So just using FBI and CDC data, a person in the US has a 1 in 500,000 chance of being struck by lightening compared to 5.3 murders and 248.5 per 100,000 aggravated assaults per year. Big difference.

    Although maybe you are basing your chances on the average 22 million cloud to ground lightning flashes in the United States and coastal waters? If so, it just shows how people try to misrepresent data, considering all the areas that are either unpopulated or sparsely populated.
     
    #127 SOS24, Mar 21, 2019
    Last edited: Mar 21, 2019
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  8. Mikhail Weiss

    Mikhail Weiss Loaded Pockets

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    Well, I've experienced one of those two events. It was not the lightning strike.
     
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  9. Telstar

    Telstar Loaded Pockets

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    That's sounds rather high.. Tornado and storm research (TORRO) estimates 30-60 people are stuck each year. Further data suggests that for the past 20 years the US has averaged approx 51 strikes per year.

    It goes without saying that violent crime easily dwarfs lighting strikes on people. The comparison is quite comical
     
  10. Burncycle

    Burncycle Loaded Pockets

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    I too have an NAA revolver (a Pug) and it's great little gun! As far as .22 Magnum goes, FMJ loads will generally do 14-16" of penetration even out of the Pug's diminutive barrel, which makes it a viable option for self defense IMO as long as you do your part. While I would certainly carry it if I had nothing else, I generally do not -- primarily because just about any instance I can think of where I would carry the Pug, I could just as easily take along a small 32 or 380 like the LCP or P32/P3AT and be just as concealable.

    Pocket carry definitely has it's advantages, as you can walk inconspicuously with your hand in your pocket on the firearm out to your car in the middle of the night with no one the wiser, but with some of my jeans it's very difficult to draw from a seated position inside the car (your mileage may vary) so I find as a compromise I generally opt for IWB strong side.

    As far as a minimal hot weather setup goes, I've had good luck with belt clip + MIC holster IWB at around 3-3:30
    (Basically this, but with the pinky extension)

    [​IMG]


    Easier to draw when seated in a car than in the front pocket, and it frees up my pockets for all my regular stuff. Plus, it's where I carry anyway when I am carrying a larger firearm so when I instinctively reach that way it'll be there!

    My T-Shirt would be untucked normally, but for demonstration purposes...


    [​IMG]


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    For deep concealment, I tuck the grip inside the waistband. Here it really just looks like a pocket knife, but draw speed obviously suffers.

    Normally though, I'll have it canted forward slightly so the pinky extension is out (riding on the waistband). Retention is excellent since the belt is tight, and it doesn't move.

    It still doesn't print -- but now drawing is quick and easy -- thumb joint indexes over the rear sight and ring finger snags the pinky extension as I pull up, the fingers transition to their normal position at this phase so you can fire from retention once the holster is tugged away or continue the draw to full extension.

    Note though that you don't have to be wearing a belt and can just as easily loop the lanyard around the belt loop instead. Further, with this setup you can load or clear the firearm and at no time have to expose the trigger while doing so, which is nice even though it's not a necessity.

    _____________________

    The downside is if you're wearing clothing that doesn't have a belt or belt loop (such as jogging pants or shorts) because then you have to use your off hand to yank the lanyard and pull the MIC holster off before you can fire, which is not ideal.

    It takes a few minutes but this is easily remedied by box-stitching a small loop of bias tape inside the waistband of the shorts or sweats (maybe a 1" loop, tucked away so you can't see it) and use that to larkshead your holster lanyard around.
     
    #130 Burncycle, Apr 5, 2019
    Last edited: Apr 5, 2019
  11. Ethos

    Ethos Loaded Pockets

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    Sounds like you've made up your mind. You're making a lot of assumptions about what others are carrying instead of assuming that they've done it long enough to figure out how to carry a capable firearm and 'look' natural and comfortable, and blend in.
    I know a lot of people from Texas, and all of them carry more capable firearms iwb. The only exception is a pocket gun while they are at work which are still more capable firearms, usually a Jframe or Glock 43.

    Find some pants where you can wear a gun belt, leather or reinforced belt. Shouldn't be any reason you cant carry a G43, Shield, Kahr CM9, Sig 938. Or in the least a G42 or LCP II, KeltecP32. Several methods of carry from IWB, or OWB with a cover shirt like an open button up, or even pocket if that suits you.

    I have carried an NAA lots of times, but only if there's no other option, which is rare.
     
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  12. les snyder

    les snyder Loaded Pockets

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    Burncycle... check your unloaded P3AT behind the trigger and see if your model has the axis pin visible (it connects the trigger to the rotating mechanism that operates the trigger action bar)... if so I would suggest a drop of epoxy to lock it in place... mine slid down out of the top of the trigger axis, and would not allow the trigger to move the trigger bar enough to allow the hammer to release, before the trigger contacted the frame, stopping rearward movement
     
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  13. weklund

    weklund Loaded Pockets

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    I am with you ... :) I am a front pocket cargo short carry dude as well. My Sig P238 is an excellent package. I have been shooting the 1911 platform for over 35+ years and can't say enough good things about the compact yet mighty P238. The addition of a Crimson Trace Green laser is a big plus for swift target acquisition. My favorite CCW EDC these days followed by my laser equipped S&W 641-1.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
    #133 weklund, Jul 9, 2019
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2019
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