Separate names with a comma.
Are you a current member with account or password issues?
Please visit following page for more information
Discussion in 'First Aid Station' started by bmstrong, Oct 30, 2017.
Good article. I am a high school teacher and one of our inservice sessions this year was bleeding training for potential mass shooter scenarios in school. I found it to be the most informative and practical sessions I have ever been to. We learned about much of the same information in this article.
I have since built my own bleed stoppage kit that I keep in my pack all the time.
It is interesting how the recommendation in regards to tourniquets has changed over the years. I still remember the time when it was taught as a last resort which would almost certainly lead to amputation, but now it is recognized as a life saving measure and may not lead to amputation.
I have carried a first aid kit in my car for a while, but now I carry an Israeli bandage with gloves and a couple other first aid items on person. I am still considering adding a tourniquet to it but I don’t want the kit to be so big that I won’t carry it.
It was a good article. I’ve always had a very large first aid/trauma kit in the cars and a good size home kit. None had tourniquets or Israeli bandages until 2 years ago. I carry a trauma kit in my backpack now, too.
The only real criticism I have of the article is that the kit recommendations are really cool, but the prices are likely to scare some regular folks away when they could build a serviceable kit much more cheaply.
I’m going to a “Stop the Bleed” program at one of the local libraries next week. It is apparently part of a national effort by the American College of Surgeons to provide this training. It’s free and sponsored by our regional EMS Council. I’ll report back after it’s over. Here is a link to find a program near you: http://www.stopthebleedtraining.org/
I keep a CAT and combat dressngs in my EDC daypack along with a basic FAK. Former military medic.
There are frequent shootings here with random bullets flying anywhere so I keep a kit with me.
My son (9 years old at the time) took a SkinnyMedic class with me last year and he remembers a lot of the class. We did things like wound packing, pressure dressings, tourniquets, chest seals, etc. I plan for my girls to get attend similar classes with me In the next year or so.
I was never a Medic in the Army but I was an Infantryman and had a vested interest in combat medicine. I probably teach my kids and my Cub Scouts a bit more than the average Cub Scout might know or that the average 5, 8, and 10 year olds would be exposed to. My kids help me check dates and repack the first aid kits in all of our vehicles each year. There are certain things that I think people should know how to do or should have on their person in order to be good productive citizens and first aid/CPR training is right at the top of my list.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I think Wilderness First Responder + TCCC/TECC is the "right" training for a layman who wants to be prepared. EMT training, having early on been an EMT-B/P myself, is fairly low yield past first responder for the prepared citizen's needs.
If your concerned about bleeding stoppage get the following in vacuum packs; trauma bandage (Israeli is my preference), abd pad, occlusive dressing, roll of Kling, small sharpe, Trauma shears, gloves. A tourniquet can be quickly made from a triangular bandage and a pen. Leave out the band-aids, wound wipes and anything else to treat minor wounds. No one will die of a small cut, hay fever or lac that needs a few stitches.
BTW; how accesable is your car kit during your normal activities? Unless you are trained to and want to stop for car wrecks, supplies should be on you or where you need them.
Could we maybe stop spreading the myth of the effective improvised tourniquet with belts, triangular bandages, ropes or whatever?
It is not effective, planning to use improvised medical gear is planning to fail, purpose built and tested tourniquets save lives. Improvised tourniquets have a use, in situations where nothing else is available. They might work and if that's all that's available that's fine, improvised tourniquets have saved lives as well, because nothing else was available. Just like improvised weapons have taken and saved lives. But planning to improvise a tourniquet is downright stupid.
Agree! I can't imagine a situation where I would want to plan to improvise something (that seems the very antithesis of planning).
I have a torniquet in my journalism bag, and another at the office and at home. Proper tool for the job.
Even if you aren't willing to carry a CAT of a SOF-T because of the size, at least carry a RATS or a SWAT-T, something that is actually made to stop blood. Planning to use a triangular bandage is planning to let someone bleed out.
Your suggestion may work for you, but even if vacuum packed having all those items would most likely lead to exactly what I said I wanted to avoid - having too big a kit that I don’t carry it all the time. At least with the Israeli Bandage or the OSS Patrol Pocket Pack, I always have something in a pocket on me which may not be perfect but is better than nothing.
As far as the smaller first aid items, no they aren’t a matter of life or death, but are more likely to be needed and become practical. I have had need to use (or give to others) then replace bandaids, steri-strips, moleskin, alcohol wipe, otc meds, etc on various occasions and all those could fit in a wallet or small pouch.
A major arterial bleed is like trying to stop a water hose flow with your thumb. It can be done, but the flow is just waiting to come gushing out and any slight movement of the hose or thumb causes leakage. Now, rap a band around the hose while leaving a thumb in place and see if you can occlude the hose enough to stop the gushing water. Granted, water hoses aren't analogous to arteries, but you're generally going to have direct access to an artery anyway outside heroic measures.
With an artery, to a point, the more blood that comes out the faster it's foing to continue squirting out until there's not enough intravascular pressure to really "spurt" anymore. At that point, and rather quickly, you're largely done for unless you can seal the hole and efficiently introduce more fluid. As the intravascular pressure (blood volume) reduces, heart rate and respiratory rate will increase in effort to compensate. This can work if the leak doesn't continue.
Goruck uses a shaken two liter bottle of soda in their classes. Shake, stab the bottle, and control the spray with duct tape. YouYou need a good bit of tape. If you're going to try this at home use diet soda as it won't be sticky and get something clear so it won't stain.
Would you like the contact information for the girl who is alive today because I applied tourniquets, made from triangular bandages, to her bi lateral foot amputations? What exactly do you think we did before commercial tourniquet's existed? A belt was used just last month in a case near me. I offered a compact solution to someone who is carrying NO tourniquet. Personally I carry two CAT's but Im also aware they are too large for Ped's patients and too small for the morbid obese. Being prepared is the ability to think on your feet, problem solve and use what you have.
Mr ArkansasFan, how many arterial bleed's have you actually seen? Treated? With your extensive training are you aware that many traumatic amputations and arterial bleeds have been successfully treated in the field, that's why commercial TQ's exist, why the military and many LE agencies now train and carry them. Unlike tape a TQ does not have to stick, only constrict. The Israel pressure bandage is designed with no adhesive for that purpose. It is equipped with cloth ties so the dressing can occlude blood flow from a severe wound. All this learned because what was being done before was not working. It wont save them all but its the best we have now.
If you read my post again you will see that I acknowledge the use of improvised tourniquets and that they have saved lives. What I argue against is suggestions to actually plan to improvise a tourniquet, big difference between the two.
Guess I mis understood "planning to use improvised...is planning to fail" and "Could we maybe stop spreading the myth of the effective improvised tourniquet with belts, triangular bandages, ropes or whatever?"
Actually planning on what you might do if caught without can be an effective way of setting up success. The ability to improvise and adapt is key in any emergency. Had I not thought about what I might do in a mass casualty incident or situation where a commercial device was not sized properly, not available or failed, I might not have been able to act fast enough in that case. I can site other cases where Ive had to improvise equipment or adapt due to size issues space constraints or simply not having enough.
Im not trying to create conflict here but Ive been at this a long time and seen a lot. Peds and the elderly are particularly challenging. C-collars don't fit, skin is fragile, hard to examine in the field.
Found This regarding tourniqets
I'm a psychiatric nurse in the UK. Despite having very little real medical and traumatic injury training, I am expected (as part of my professional registration) to render aid if I am first on scene for a casualty event. Obviously the level of aid I provide is to be within my competency level.
I need better training to be honest. My employer provided very little for us if it's not deemed essential for work. I'm about 8 years out of date with any formal first aid training, and only certified in CPR and anaphylaxis ( my daughter is nut allergic....)