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In trouble at work, need help, EDC in jepardy.

Discussion in 'EDC Clothing' started by Mr BadWrench, Apr 5, 2012.

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  1. Crash_Fistfight

    Crash_Fistfight Loaded Pockets

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    Just to get this straight, you are risking a paycheck over cargo pants. Rules are rules, regardless of what you think. You have managed to single yourself out over a pair of pants. Go along to get along, not only will you be employed, but you won't be in the cross-hairs when layoff time roles around.
    Remember, the squeaky wheel gets the grease (or the boot).
     
  2. DBR

    DBR Loaded Pockets

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    Well, it's still a petty authority style move. Some control freak higher up on the foodchain did it instead of a Little Napoleon, we're talking about a Big Hitler. :D
     
  3. DBR

    DBR Loaded Pockets

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    Incredible post. The Japanese Proverb of, "The nail that sticks up will be pounded down" is far more appropriate.

    He will still be in the crosshairs when layoff time comes around.

    Rules are rules...I could have a field day with that, but it's just...too...tiring.
     
  4. Crash_Fistfight

    Crash_Fistfight Loaded Pockets

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    Wouldn't want to tire you out, DBR.
     
  5. DBR

    DBR Loaded Pockets

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    Well, there is nothing I could really say to address that which wouldn't be an insult.
     
  6. BullRome

    BullRome Loaded Pockets

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    I have been in the manufacturing industry for some years as a sales man. The accounting, purchasing and manufacturing areas are all located in the same building. Management decided to implement a dress code for all "front office" personell to follow. This included sales, accounting, purchasing and management. It was amazing to see the immediate panic in peoples faces as this would cause them to have to purchase a complete new wardrobe. There was no impact on the sales team, however the accounting and purchasing departments were going from jeans and t-shirts to business casual. Needless to say, management did not budge and there were a lot of hurt feelings in the building.

    I felt bad for those affected, however I do believe in dressing professional. Rules are rules. Most of us have to live under that shadow as long as we work for someone else.
     
  7. Dr Jekell
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    • In Omnia Paratus

    Dr Jekell I had fun once, It was awful.
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    I hope they gave them a grace period to allow them to purchase said new wardrobe.
     
  8. DBR

    DBR Loaded Pockets

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    In my experience, I hope they gave them a raise or they otherwise suffered a pay cut, didn't they?
     
  9. Mr BadWrench

    Mr BadWrench Loaded Pockets

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    This is the reason I started at this board. Real advice and info, not just flaming and anger.

    A few people have commented about me risking my livelihood over a pair of pants. Ive missed one day of work in 2 years and Ive been late twice, Both times because I hit deer on my way to work. I work late, skip lunches and come in on my day off when called. When I decided I wanted to change my wardrobe I read the dress code, asked permission and made sure I was not causing any problems. My new manager had obviously never read the original dress code in the handbook when I asked permission, lied to me about it and then tried to get me in trouble with upper management. Had I not already also asked my DM and had a discussion about clothes wearing too quickly I would never even have bought the clothes to begin with. Another manager told me that they want us to look like "Office Professionals", Office workers do not install batteries in rusty cars when its 10 degrees outside. Neither are they expected to wrestle brake calipers full of fluid or change pulleys on an alternator.

    Im going to email duluth back about the return. Its a shame because ive gotten spoiled by having a cellphone pocket on my leg.

    Much more lucid when im not fresh off a 10 hour shift.
     
  10. chrisr

    chrisr Loaded Pockets

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    Sorry, but cargo pants are NOT office professional looking. They may be practical, they may be comfortable, but they do not look professional. It sucks you went and bought multiple pairs, thinking they were ok. But this is a fight you just aren't going to win. At best, it will be overlooked in the next corporate inspection, but you will always be looking over your shoulder when this will catch up to you. My advice: find some durable work pants that don't have cargo pockets. Maybe just buy a pair or two and do laundry more often. Another option to make the pants last longer might be to see if there is some type of outer garment you are allowed to put on over your clothes when doing something grimy.
     
  11. neutrontech
    • In Omnia Paratus

    neutrontech Loaded Pockets

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    This is highly subjective. The right style of cargo pants can look completely professional, depending on the type of work. IT work for example, I see cargos as much more professional than slacks BECAUSE of the function. It looks a lot more professional to me to see someone prepared, than someone having to run around looking for something because they didn't have it on them.

    I require people working for me to wear cargo pants and a company supplied polo.
     
    EndlessFields, DBR and 0dBm like this.
  12. BullRome

    BullRome Loaded Pockets

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    No grace period or raise. When the office personnel addressed it to management they were told they already make a professional wage. They were also told they should know how to dress professionally. It was sad and i felt bad for them, but The crazy thing is, sales went from wearing ties every day to golf shirts. How could I complain?
     
  13. 0dBm

    0dBm Loaded Pockets

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    This is a good point and completely true. The slacks that I wear typically may be prescribed or required by fashion, etiquette, or custom; however, it may be overdone or inappropriate in certain work environments that dictate a certain functionality to be de rigueur. It appears that the OP's management ranks aspire to elevate the norm to something that is not necessarily engraved in stone; however, one that was subjectively interpreted not quite to the reasonable expectation of those affected. It happens quite frequently in the middle management ranks where Management by Objectives (MBOs) often dictate the course of action to achieve them but may summarily conflict with those involved.
     
  14. Mitty

    Mitty Loaded Pockets

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    Thanks. Some thought so. Some didn't. Hopefully those who did were in the majority, but you never know ...

    For sure some of the ones who didn't were those who saw it, and made it, an adversarial relationship. (as implied by a few posts here, though not by the OP I think.)

    Re comments about "power trip" management re dress code. If the supervisor/manager is expected to have everyone adhering to any rule, including a dress code, it is not his prerogative to do otherwise. Just as it is not the carpenter's prerogative to build something different than he has been paid to build.

    Re dress codes in general, it is a very legitimate goal for a company to want to present a high-quality, consistent image. Dress affects customers' perception of the company and, even, employees perceptions of themselves. To implement that, a dress code should be clear, suited to the type of work being done, enforced even-handedly, and communicated well. But even if all those targets are not hit dead center, it still falls to lower level management to enforce the policy with their best efforts. Ideally they will also communicate any flaws upwards so that they can be corrected.

    It sounds to me like the OP's management is doing a pretty good job at this and that he is doing a pretty good job of not creating an unproductive, adversarial situation.
     
  15. DBR

    DBR Loaded Pockets

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    I'm 43 years old and I would like to say that all of that makes a difference when it comes time to put heads on chopping blocks, but it doesn't really matter. I've busted my hump and watched "extras" and "favors" then become demanded, went through pay and benefit cuts and the rest of the horror shows and it has left me more than a little jaded.

    And...you're brilliant! In two very simple and wonderful sentences you have summed up quite nicely why these people making the oh-so-worshiped "rules" who do nothing but push paper and people around don't "get." They don't understand because they don't really work for a living. They just pass down edicts for others to follow and it doesn't matter if they make no sense. So, they are not purchasing pants for you. So they expect you to work in an environment where you are constantly purchasing clothing to keep up with their demonstrably stupid idea of what "professionalism" entails while you are basically doing light mechanical work in the parking lot. There is a lot more to life than "rules are rules" just like there is more to life than "laws are laws." Sometimes something is stupid and it should be discussed. This is what I was trying to get across about my Wife's one manager position. They wanted her to dress like someone on a daytime soap opera and unload trucks, too, work the floor. Earlier on, someone intoned the word "insane" and I thought it was a little harsh at first but I guess people can become so detached with the lives of others they might as well be insane.
     
  16. DBR

    DBR Loaded Pockets

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    Well, that's part of the problem right there. If they expect him to go out in the parking lot and do automotive work the clothing they are demanding that he wear is not "suited to the type of work being done." So they are not "doing a pretty good job at this," are they? So if he stops doing that stuff out in the parking lot I'm sure that will be addressed in some form or fashion as well. So, the only thing for the thinking human unit to do is take the pay cut and buy the proper corporate monkeysuit that they are demanding and find another job. :)
     
  17. DBR

    DBR Loaded Pockets

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    Good for you! Common sense is alive and well on an individual basis...on the corporate level, it's basically D.O.A.
     
  18. Mitty

    Mitty Loaded Pockets

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    DBR, it's pretty safe to predict that people will behave towards you the way you behave towards them.

    There is also a concept is psychology called "projection." A real psychologist would give you a complex explanation, but my takeaway is that people expect others to behave in the same way that they themselves would behave. And they see in others the same qualities that they themselves have. This is why, for example, an honest person is the easiest to swindle.

    Over hundreds of job interviews, my most effective question was "Tell me about the last place you worked. What was it like? What were the people like?" And 99% of the time the applicant ended up telling me about him/herself.

    So from what you've said here I'm not at all surprised that you have had unpleasant job experiences. Sorry to hear it, though.
     
  19. neutrontech
    • In Omnia Paratus

    neutrontech Loaded Pockets

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    Sometimes it's nothing to do with anything other than a power trip. I've had friends become managers at their jobs, and their behavior in such a position would completely contrast their personality because they let the power get to them. I've seen co workers promoted behave the same way, I've had many managers the same way. They start using their position as a means to make themselves feel better, or to deal out vengeance.

    You are right that many times it is the employee who simply expects too much from their job, or believes he/she should be an exception to the rule. But too many people in management positions fail to realize that the former is true a lot more times than given credit.

    It's not always a psychological "projection", often the wrong types of people get put in a management position because of someone they know, even when they completely lack the requirements to be a good manager.
     
  20. DBR

    DBR Loaded Pockets

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    Oh, another Internet Psychologist/Psychiatrist, how rare. :::rolleyes:::

    Did you ever stop to think that I was, at one time, Joe Kiss-:censored: and did all of the stuff the right way and ended up being cynical because I have been screwed? You know, people like you have an answer for everything and if someone had a crappy experience, it was obviously their own fault. Everything that is wrong in the workplace today can, in large part, be found right in this thread. I am "projecting" because I just so happen to actually remember what people say to me and when the stories change and I remember, I'm the bad apple in the barrel. And this is not rare at all in people, you can believe it or not. My last boss gave me specific instructions which I then wrote down about my schedule in a notebook. When I arrived on site, his underling told me that my schedule that I asked my boss to repeat so I could double-check it, was wrong. He called bossman up on the phone and put him on speaker phone and he agreed with underling. Now, I know what happened. Bossman was unprepared, in his car and talking on a cellphone in traffic because I remember the call. But it angers me to basically be called a liar or a moron when you could simply admit you made a mistake.

    Has anyone ever called you a moron or a liar or implied it? Did you like it?

    THAT is the kind of experiences I have had all of my life and if you choose to now perform a B.S. psychoanalysis on that, feel free! It tells more about you than me.

    Done. I have better things to do with my free time than get angry...errah../angrier...at another wack on the 'net.
     
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