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Home/Outdoor Defense Gun

Discussion in 'Handguns' started by WildEMT, Aug 31, 2008.

  1. arizona-hermit

    arizona-hermit Empty Pockets

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    Pistols at home are merely delaying devices that allow you to get to your 'real' weapon.

    I prefer the Mossberg 590 or a .44 Magnum lever rifle.

    Outdoors, it would depend solely on what you were doing at the time. A .22 rifle/pistol, a 12 guage shotgun with appropriate .22, 9MM, or .44 Mag handgun, or a .44 Mag rifle and matching handgun are all commonly used.

    If I feel like some long range shooting, I use a 300 Win Mag rifle and whatever handgun I feel like wearing at the time.
     
  2. dl52163

    dl52163 Loaded Pockets

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    I carry a Ruger 22/45 on me and for other there could be a Mossberg 12 or my favorite M6 Scout.
     
  3. peacefuljeffrey

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    Get a Heckler & Koch USP and you will have your needs covered.
    Get a Glock in .45 and you will likewise have your needs covered.

    If "simplest possible" is a strong criterion, then get the Glock.
    I don't know much about the .357 Sig cartridge at all, but I would prefer .45 ACP over it simply because it is far more widely available.
     
  4. peacefuljeffrey

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    I don't live where there are moose and never have. But I'm pretty sure that from pictures and such that I've seen, they are HUGE animals. I wouldn't think there are many handgun rounds, if any, that can put them down quickly enough to end their threat before they can do you in.

    I now think of moose as, well, just skinny woolly mammoths without tusks. For those of you who have encountered them, is that close to right?
     
  5. JonSidneyB
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    JonSidneyB Uber Prepared
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    Moose are just plain huge...and they are not nice.

    When I have seen them I just stayed as far from them as I could and watched from a distance.

    They don't look skinny when ya see them.

    .44 magnum can do the job buy many will tell you that is too light. The fact is it has worked many times but that does not mean it is not smallish for the job.

    The largest creatures in North America have been dropped by heavy .357 magnum loads but some will say that is way to light. These are not 125 grain street loads but heavy weight bullets.

    While the .45 acp has a good street record I think it is lacking as a field gun. For field gun use things are not the same as urban pistol craft. Distances on average are quite a bit further and sight radius quickly becomes something nice to have as well as speeder bullets. Most auto-loaders for the heavier hitters start to get a bit large for easy carry and the ones that are not overly large start to get finicky due to slide velocity.

    The heavy hitters I feel for now still belong to the realm of revolvers. This may change in the future but for now potent auto-loading field guns have something to be desired. The 10mm is ahead of the .357 magnum in ballistics but the .357 in by no means considered a heavy hitter by outdoorsman.

    While ligher guns can do the job for big North American critters I would start with .44 magnum as the minimum. There are some .41 magnum devotees that will differ with that it can get the job done well.. While the 10mm does intrude on the low end of .41 magnum ballistics it cannot compare with the stout loads coming out of a 5 or 6 inch revolver tube.

    While you will probably never have to stop a moose if the day comes that you do have to. If it were me I would select a .44 magnum or .45 Long Colt that can handle the pressures of heavier loads. While many will tell you to go heavier and they could be right I would have trouble carrying something larger in the field comfortably.
     
  6. bartsdad

    bartsdad Loaded Pockets

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    During the 2 years I spent guiding canoe trips in the BWCAW I've encountered a moose or 2. There is nothing like rounding a bend and being eye to knee-cap with almost a ton moose. :shocked: :shocked: :I guess they aren't quite wooly mamoth, but they are darned close. Even though they are herbivores, I sure wouldn't want to peeve one off.
     
  7. parawolfe

    parawolfe Empty Pockets

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    First of all a pistol is not the best weapon for home defense, I'm sure most will agree. For that, a good pump shotgun like a Remington 870 or a Mossberg 500 Persuader best fits the bill. You want a weapon that would have quite a job range. There is one handgun that Taurus makes that might be what you're looking for. It's called "The Taurus Judge", so named because of the number of judges who carry it into the courtroom for their protection. It's too large for every day carry but would work great for home defense and protection in the great outdoors. Use the .410 shells for home defense and the .45 cal for outdoor defense. You can buy .410 shells in #000 Buck and alternate between the #000 Buck, slugs and lead shot. I don't know your living situation but using a high velocity weapons for home defense isn't a good idea. Any stray rounds could easily exit your home and hit the neighbors. I own a Smith & Wesson 686 which is a .357 revolver. Great weapon and fun to shoot but would never use it as a home defense weapon. Check out the Taurus Judge at a local gun store and see if it's for you.

    parawolfe
     
  8. Duckman1975

    Duckman1975 Empty Pockets

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    I carry a Glock 22 with corbon hallowpoints around the farm and for home defence, I know a shotgun would probably be better but its too big to handle sometimes.
     
  9. Peter21197

    Peter21197 Empty Pockets

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    I have a smith m28 Highway Patrolman. It's a great revolver. Big and able to take heavy loads. At home I pack light 38 loads, out and about I load it with heavy 180g semi wad cutters. I would not hunt big bear with it-I would use a rifle but I am confindent about it's put down power. I've dropped boar with it one shot no prob, for 1 gun to do all? a 6" .357mag is the most versatile round/pistol combo out there. I combine it with a Marlin 1894c .357mag carbine. Great fast handling rifle and it allows me shots out to about 125 yards. 1 caliber for both the rifle and pistol, life is beautiful.
     
  10. Duckman1975

    Duckman1975 Empty Pockets

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    I see that revolvers are still pretty popular. The automatic pistol have gone through a lot of improvement and are very reliable, what is the secret of the revolver that it is popular even today?
     
  11. Dirty Bob

    Dirty Bob Loaded Pockets

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    Revolvers can handle heavier loads without problems, while an autopistol needs to be fed loads that fall into a set range of power if it is to function properly. An autopistol is a balance of slide weight, locking method and spring tension. If loads are too light, they won't cycle the action. Loads that are too heavy can peen parts of the gun with excessive slide velocities.

    To make an auto that handles heavy loads, you often end up with a gun that looks like a CZ-52 or a Desert Eagle. On the other hand, some revolvers are fairly light and handy, considering the ammo they can fire. Examples include S&W Mountain Guns and Ruger Blackhawks. These aren't small guns, but they are much easier to carry than a Desert Eagle. At the same time, they can also fire the lightest target ammo without malfunctioning. Finally, revolvers have a reputation for fine accuracy. Some autopistols are very accurate, but a lot of revolvers exhibit near match-grade accuracy, once you find the right load.

    Autopistols are great, and they are deservedly popular. It's just that for the kind of shooting that many do in the outdoors, the revolver often fits better than an auto.

    Regards,
    Dirty Bob
     
  12. outdoorsman1911

    outdoorsman1911 Loaded Pockets

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    Anyone can shoot a revolver(perhaps not accurately) while :censored: generally require a learning curve with autos.

    Cant limp wrist a revolver. Another round is just a trigger pull away with a revolver, vs. a slide rack and trigger pull with a auto. Dirty bob summed it up well on the loads.
     
  13. nypdblue

    nypdblue Loaded Pockets

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    Colt Defender .45 or a Remington 870 pump
     
  14. peacefuljeffrey

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    It comes down to perceived tradeoffs, then, right? I don't see the possibility of limp-wristing my Glock as looming very large for me, so I prefer to "risk" it and keep 16 rounds of .40 available to me, as opposed to a maximum of what, 8 rounds of an appreciably powered revolver cartridge? Some say, "If you couldn't do it with six rounds..." Yeah, well, talk to Massad Ayoob about the wisdom of carrying a minimum of ammo with you. He is a staunch advocate of a spare magazine, let alone a high-capacity firearm.

    And if the "learning curve" for a semi-auto presents so much of a challenge that a newbie can't be taught to master its functioning in, say, two hours of instruction with a competent teacher, then that person should be stripped of ALL guns, and forced to wear a helmet in his everyday life; not allowed to vote or procreate; forbidden to drive a car... I mean come on, it's not flying the space shuttle.
     
  15. Vic303

    Vic303 Loaded Pockets

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    Here's a link to some BuffaloBore loads for the heavy .357mag.
    Heavy .357
     
  16. JonSidneyB
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    JonSidneyB Uber Prepared
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    Tap Rack Bang Drills and other exercises take time to master. There are quite a few things that Autoloaders do better than Revolvers. At the same time there are Things the Revolver does better than the Autoloader.

    Remember also this is a field gun by his outdoors setting. A field gun is a bit different than most CCW environments.
     
  17. parawolfe

    parawolfe Empty Pockets

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    Don't forget, the type of ammo is extremely important too. Check out both Glazer Safety Slugs and Pow'RBall ammo. Glazer Safety Slugs are great for home defense, they have awesome stopping power. What also makes them great for home defense is that they disperse on contact so any errant rounds won't kill the neighbors accidentally. The Pow'RBall ammo would be great for outdoor defense. It allows deeper penetration. So combine a typical .45 with Pow'RBall ammo and then you have serious knock down power. Be advised, this ammo isn't cheap, use cheap target rounds for practice.

    Going back to my earlier post, you want a handgun that is capable of home defense and outdoor defense. Two completely different scenarios. Shotguns are best for home defense because they are basically point and click. Obviously, making sure that any person or pets you care about are behind you. Four outdoor defense you would want something with a heavy caliber and good penetration. The .357's many are mentioning in this thread would be great for that. But you want something that will do both, home and outdoor defense. A .357 handgun or any handgun isn't the best choice for home defense. That is why I suggest you check out The Taurus Judge. It fires .410 shotgun shells or .45 ACP. A .410 shell doesn't sound impressive but if you use the right type of shell like #000 buck it is very capable. Keep it loaded with #000 buck or alternate #000 buck and slugs for home defense. For outdoor defense load it with .45 Pow'RBall ammo. Check out your local gun store/range and see if they have any you can test fire. Whatever you decide to get, let's hope you never have to use it.
     
  18. JonSidneyB
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    JonSidneyB Uber Prepared
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    Out in the wilds penetration is sometimes a more important factor than quick energy transfer. Powerball ammo is actually to enhance feed reliability with an expanding bullet in autoloaders. I am guessing the original poster is in a rural area. When your neighbors are a mile apart bullet disintegration is not factor you are looking for.
     
  19. parawolfe

    parawolfe Empty Pockets

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    That's the beauty of Glazer Safety Slugs though, they're not just about disintegration. "Stopping power is maximized by the complete dispersal of the bullet energy into the intended target with immediate shock and trauma. This rapid fragmentation delivers the energy to a large area. Reduced recoil allows a fast recovery for follow up shots if necessary." Not to mention they come in two different types, blue and silver. "Glaser BLUE uses #12 shot compressed into a solid form. The Glaser BLUE produces immediate energy dispersal into the target, reducing the possibility of over penetration and creating abrupt stopping power. The numerous projectiles disperses outward generating an effective wound cavity." "Glaser SILVER is made up of #6 shot. With the Silver load, you get much larger segments; deeper penetration and controlled energy release."

    All that said, a shotgun is still far superior a weapon for home defense than any handgun. Mr. Intruder isn't going to ring your door bell in the middle of the night and let you know he is stopping by. If you are suddenly startled awake in the middle of the night you aren't going to be clear headed enough to be firing a handgun accurately. The beauty of a shotgun, especially with the correct ammo, is that accuracy isn't important. With a shotgun loaded with #00 Buck or #1 Buck or both the stopping power is awesome. Literally, spraying without the need for praying.
     
  20. JonSidneyB
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    JonSidneyB Uber Prepared
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    Many people wanting something for the outdoors are going to want closer to 16 inches of penetration and may start favoring momentum over ft lbs.

    Glasers do amazing things but at the same time have major failings. Cartridges like all things have strengths and weaknesses. Glaser does what it does well but other things very poorly. The glasers also range very poorly.