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Do you always carry with a round in the chamber?

Discussion in 'Handguns' started by MerdachPKP, May 12, 2012.

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  1. Bama Joe

    Bama Joe Empty Pockets

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    Always and forever. :)
     
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  2. paaiyan

    paaiyan Loaded Pockets

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    Boy have I got just the thing for you!

    Two in the chamber
     
  3. Kripto

    Kripto Evil Sid

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    I'm not a fan of CCW, personally I don't think that 99.99% of people who carry have been properly trained to handle a stressful situation where they have to use a firearm. (remember, you should know what is both in front and behind the target before firing... How many people have perfected the whole tunnelvision issue?) Anyway, if I was required to carry a weapon on me, I sure as heck would keep a round in the chamber. The time it takes to wither rack the slide or pull back for a double action is significant and could mean the difference between you getting your opponent or them getting you.

    Just my .02 :)
     
  4. scottryla

    scottryla Loaded Pockets

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    I wonder if I could conceal that, thanks for showing me.
     
  5. paaiyan

    paaiyan Loaded Pockets

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    Don't believe it's available for sale in the US currently. IIRC, they're going to have a fight with the BATF about whether it's a machine gun or not, since it fires more than one round with one trigger pull.

    "The Gun Control Act of 1968 (GCA) at 18 U.S.C. 921(a)(23), and the National Firearms
    Act (NFA) at 26 U.S.C. 5845(b), define the term “machinegun” as “any weapon which
    shoots, is designed to shoot, or can be readily restored to shoot, automatically more than
    one shot, without manual reloading, by a single function of the trigger.”"
     
  6. kursac

    kursac Loaded Pockets

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    Cocked and locked with 1 in the tube. 1911
     
  7. mud.

    mud. Loaded Pockets

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    Yes on a Walther PPS. If I had a 1911 or something like it I think I would leave it uncocked though. I don't like the idea of the trigger being live without some sort of additional operator action. But I also don't carry for a living and train excessively.


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  8. kursac

    kursac Loaded Pockets

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    I guess it comes with understanding the firearm, I certainly would not be comfortable with the hammer sitting on the pin that was sitting on a live round. Racking the slide in a confrontation will get you killed or shot with your own pistol. I would love a perp to pull an un chambered 1911 on me because I could take his gun right out of his hand or he would be dead plain and simple. Now there are 2 safeties on a 1911 that have to be released and then you have to drop the hammer. To be honest nothing makes me more comfortable than a cocked and locked 1911. I can at least look at the firearm and see the condition it is in and know its safe.
     
  9. mud.

    mud. Loaded Pockets

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    Absolutely I agree. Racking is not an option. But with the 1911 you at least can leave the hammer in the half cocked position. Plus there are manual safeties. I'm much more comfortable with a 1911...I love the PPS but wish it either had a hammer or an external safety other than the trigger safety. I know there is plenty of OE with Glock and such that proves the concept, I'm just old fashioned I guess.


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  10. mud.

    mud. Loaded Pockets

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    Or. I guess I would like the option to have another layer of safety. An uncocked 1911 is über safe, but with a simple action it's ready.


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  11. kursac

    kursac Loaded Pockets

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    It all comes downt to what your comfortable with. It doesn't matter how safe it is as long as you are comfortable with it. I have had employees say you have that cocked and I say well I hope so because its the safe 1911 is cocked and locked. But then if that freaks you out then maybe a different firearm is for you. That's why their are so many to choose, life is truly sweet
     
  12. mud.

    mud. Loaded Pockets

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    Agreed:). I'm getting more and more used to it. Mainly I think part of me just wants to try something else just to expand my collection;-)


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  13. M_Albert

    M_Albert Loaded Pockets

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    I have a couple friends who are State Troopers, and one day we got into a brief discussion about concealed carrying. I mentioned that I did not carry my Glock with a round in the chamber, and they took that opportunity to "educate" me. Like most others have already said... statistically, if you have to draw your firearm, you will need it NOW. There will be no time to go through all the motions necessary to rack a round into the chamber, chances are if you had to, then the threat would already be upon you by the time you could get the gun loaded, and would now be beyond your ability to deal with. Your very small window to negate or disable the threat will have passed, and you very well could be injured or killed, holding your own (unloaded) gun.

    Secondly, in a situation where silence is paramount (e.g. hiding, but with firearm at the ready), you almost certainly will not be able to rack a round quietly enough to not be detected.

    It was definitely a wakeup call, and I took it to heart. I did however practice with the gun a whole lot more, both shooting and drawing, to be comfortable carrying it in the loaded and ready to fire state. I personally believe that to do any less, is to put yourself at a disadvantage.
     
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  14. SAKplumber
    • In Omnia Paratus

    SAKplumber EDC Junkie!!!!!

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    ^score 2 points for "locked-n-loaded"
     
  15. chaosmagnet
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    chaosmagnet Loaded Pockets

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    Huh? I wouldn't consider myself an expert on the platform but I do I own two of them and neither have a half-cocked position. My primary carry weapon used to be a Kimber Pro Carry II, and I carried it cocked and locked.
     
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  16. mud.

    mud. Loaded Pockets

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    I could be mistaken. I have a Springfield 1911. And iirc you could pull the hammer back about 1/8" and it would rest there.

    Unfortunately this is one that's locked at my parents in my dads safe, it hasn't made the transplant to my house yet...so can't check to verify.


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  17. chaosmagnet
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    chaosmagnet Loaded Pockets

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    Weird that I'd never heard of that. In any event, I would recommend against carrying any handgun that required more taking off a thumb safety and squeezing the trigger to fire. You can train to take the safety off during the drawstroke without losing time, but I don't think there's any way to safely train to draw and :censored: (or draw and rack) as quickly.
     
  18. Chimay

    Chimay Loaded Pockets

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    I've seen one technique that does it quickly. If I recall its an Israeli technique which I thought was strange (figured they'd be all for leaving a round chambered). After the draw as you are pushing the gun out from your chest your off hand racks the slide, pivots on your wrist and becomes your support hand. If you do it quickly enough your hand clears the slide just as the sights are coming into your vision. So you really do not lose any time on the draw or target acquisition, however you obviously must have two healthy arms/hands etc that are not restrained or responsible for anything else. I'd have to do a lot of searching to find it again, I came across it by chance a few years ago. Definitely a technique that would require a lot of training.

    Also I've see a holster type that you push the gun down and out and when you do it racks the slide. If you do not want a round in the chamber you pull up normally. Obviously this would be OWB only and you lose some weapon retention possibilities (from the holster). And you have to modify your draw to account for the downward motion. I think I saw these on Deadliest Warrior with the Russian special forces.

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  19. SAKplumber
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    SAKplumber EDC Junkie!!!!!

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    I have to recommend Chris Byrds Book again. This method of drawing, cocking, and aquiring a target is one of the many methods discussed in depth. Anyone who carries a firearm (& everyone in my opinion) should read this book. >>The Concealed Handgun Manual: How to Choose, Carry, and Shoot a Gun in Self Defense
    Its not gonna make you the perfect person for the job, but it will give you everything you need to consider before carrying or using your handgun. Knowing is half the battle. Take it from a proffesional that knows.
     
  20. BlueTrain

    BlueTrain Loaded Pockets

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    One of the characteristics of professional trainers is that their way is the only way. Take the Colt Government Model, for instance. I would use the 1911 instead but they quit letting soldiers take home their guns when I was in the army. Anyhow, the preferred method of carry these days is "cocked and locked." They say if you don't carry it that way, you shouldn't be even allowed to carry a gun. Well, the original carry method specified by the army was hammer down on a loaded chamber. There are still guns manufactured today for which the manual says to carry it that way, which I mention for those who read the manuals. It is a perfectly safe method for carry and the firing pin does not rest on the primer. It would take a hard blow to the hammer to cause a discharge, although the jelly-side-down theory of falling objects says that it will invariably land on the hammer. In any event, it is perfectly easy to :censored: the hammer.

    There are additional comments here, however.

    This method is even safer on pistols of recent production that feature a firing pin safety, although it does make it harder to remove the firing pin, should you ever feel the need to do that. I realize there are those who do not like all the safety features sometimes found on handguns today, thumb safeties on Colts naturally being excepted. Personally, I always found the thumb safety, any of them, to be difficult to manipulate quickly. It was a case of having to do something very exact in a particular order (safety off, trigger squeezed). But at the same time, I didn't like oversized thumb safeties either. They were not especially easier to manipulate in a hurry (for me) and appeared to be more prone to being knocked off accidentally. However, I realize that was like the magazine release button being accidently pushed and not necessarily all that likely. I also note that some like oversized magazine releases, too.

    A hammer down carry doesn't lend itself to pistols that have a round hammer spur like the Colt Commander and some models of the Browning Hi-Power. It also doesn't work for any Star single-action automatic because their firing pins are too long.

    But you all are free to use whatever method that suits you, provided I am allowed the same privilege.
     
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