1. Please update your bookmarks to use https://www.edcforums.com/
    Dismiss Notice
  2. Are you a current member with account or password issues?

    Please visit following page for more information

    Dismiss Notice

Civilian, Matriarch and copies thereof

Discussion in 'Knives' started by greenmountainbooks, Dec 30, 2016.

  1. greenmountainbooks

    greenmountainbooks Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2008
    Messages:
    427
    Likes Received:
    116
    So, in line with my previous post on the Harpy-style blade, I have been entranced of late by the Spyderco Civilian (which is hellishly expensive), the slightly smaller and much cheaper Mariarch and copies coming in from (I assume) China.
    Has anyone tried to EDC a knife of this style? I suspect the edge is very thin (in order to effectively cut people) and of course the point is obviously very fine, presumable for ease of insertion.,
    Has anyone tried any of the copies? Are they trash?
    What about the shape is it completely hopeless for anything but mayhem? I know they would not be great for food prep, but if the blade is decent and tough, it might be good for everyday envelope opening, packaging tasks, cleaning my pipe, etc.
    What are your thoughts?
     
  2. Yablanowitz
    • +2 Supporter

    Yablanowitz Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    May 29, 2006
    Messages:
    670
    Likes Received:
    887
    The Civilian is really too big for most everyday uses. The Matriarch is a bit more reasonable in that regard, and the L'il Matriarch (Delica sized) is even more so. Personally, I find the reverse-S blade shape rather annoying in everyday use. The hooked tip gets in my way when I'm trying to use the belly and the belly gets in the way when I try to use it like a hawkbill. The shape does have a following, though. At least one person has posted that he uses his Civilian for mushroom hunting. The newer ones have a stronger tip ( the serrations near the tip are not as deep as they used to be), but they still aren't warrantied for utility use.

    I have no experience with the copies, I try to avoid encouraging the counterfeiters.
     
  3. Todd21969

    Todd21969 Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2015
    Messages:
    69
    Likes Received:
    249
    I had a waved Matriarch 2, my girlfriend adopted it .

    I never carried it as a primary knife. Only as a secondary specialty blade.

    The serrated reverse S will cut through anything you need. The tip is thicker than the Civillian and the knife is warrantied by Spyderco for typical EDC use.

    Wouldn't be my choice as a stand alone knife, but I could make it as one if need be.
     
    Moshe ben David likes this.
  4. Ippon
    • +1 Supporter

    Ippon Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2013
    Messages:
    444
    Likes Received:
    401
    I agree with the posts above. That type of blade is much better at cutting certain things, aka self defense, but rather annoying when trying to cut others. They are self defense tools, that may double as a usable utility use knife. IMO, if you aren't looking for a weapon there are much much better options out there for you depending on what you'll use the knife for.

    As far as counterfeits, I"ll try not to get too passionate, but I as well as many others are highly opposed to them. It is extremely dishonest, and the more these are bought, the more the problem spirals out of control. These knifes use inferior steel, as well as other materials, questionably cheap manufacturing, etc. You will have no warranty with a clone knife. No security knowing that it'll work if heavens forbid you need it in a confrontation. No knowledge of if you'll get heat treated blade steel, or pot metal. The list goes on. Bad fakes are bad ideas.
     
    Moshe ben David likes this.
  5. Ig

    Ig Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    May 16, 2006
    Messages:
    112
    Likes Received:
    293
    I have several reverse S. Not the best blade shape for general EDC knife.
    [​IMG]
     
  6. thebruce

    thebruce Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2015
    Messages:
    17
    Likes Received:
    10
    I would not depend on a knife for self-defense purposes in a general setting. In my jurisdiction, pulling a knife on someone in a fistfight will get you in serious legal trouble no matter "who started it." In an immediate risk of life and limb scenario, I'm going for my handgun. And in between that, I'd rather have good pepper spray or a tactical flashlight.
     
    Karmakanic, Moshe ben David and Ippon like this.
  7. Ippon
    • +1 Supporter

    Ippon Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2013
    Messages:
    444
    Likes Received:
    401
    +1
     
  8. greenmountainbooks

    greenmountainbooks Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2008
    Messages:
    427
    Likes Received:
    116
    Hearty agreement.
     
  9. greenmountainbooks

    greenmountainbooks Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2008
    Messages:
    427
    Likes Received:
    116
    The blue or gray knives look like the most promising for EDC, but you are right, the tip is too fine for many things, including making lunch, which is one of my major criteria for judging if a knife can be used daily. I might be able to cut and spread a bagel with the non-serrated ones, but that is about it I would think. Maybe cut a steak.
     
  10. greenmountainbooks

    greenmountainbooks Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2008
    Messages:
    427
    Likes Received:
    116
    A
    Agreement, I do not support using a knife for self defense. Total agreement, I was just curious as to how generally useful the shape would be. As regards counterfeits, I agree, mostly but the shape is not patented. I would have purchased a clone, not a knife that claims to be what it is not. A good analogy would be my Cutting Horse Harpies. They do not pretend to be manufactured by a major name like Spyderco, and you are right. The small ones have terribly bad edge retention. The big one, 4" blade is much better for some reason, but is too large for my edc.
    They did serve the purpose though of allowing me to find out if the shape was workable. It sort of is, but it is not ideal for many purposes.
    Incidentally, when used for utility, the harpy-shape shares, I would think, heavy reliance on the tip for slicing. Most of the cutting is done in the first 1/4": of the blade. It wears and blunts badly.
    Does anyone know of an affordable version of the matriarch?
    What I really want is a straight blade, plastic or Delrin scales (not so heavy as most knives today), affordable so it can be beaten on or lost, light in the pocket, no more than 4" and a bit less (like 3.5") would be desirable. A broad tip would be nice too. Back in the '80s this style of knife was common, but today manufacturers seem to favor slabs of metal for the handle. Too heavy.
    I could maybe use a knife with this for backpacking too. I had a Parker back in the day and it fit the bill to a T.
     
    Last edited by greenmountainbooks, Jan 2, 2017
    #10 greenmountainbooks, Jan 2, 2017
    Last edited: Jan 2, 2017
  11. greenmountainbooks

    greenmountainbooks Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2008
    Messages:
    427
    Likes Received:
    116
     
  12. greenmountainbooks

    greenmountainbooks Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2008
    Messages:
    427
    Likes Received:
    116
    Your pictures have convinced me. The smaller blue model near the bottom might be good for everyday, the the ultra fine points on the others are worthless. The harpy style blade was great for cutting cordage, but not wildly useful otherwise.
     
  13. silverspurr

    silverspurr Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2011
    Messages:
    394
    Likes Received:
    3,608
    Chinese Efengrow flipper:
    Not something I would be interested in.


    [​IMG]

    My Civilian and Matriarch 2 with Wave feature.

    [​IMG]


    [​IMG]

    Civilian with beautiful custom scales.

    [​IMG]
     
    Moshe ben David likes this.
  14. Donut
    • GITD Manix 2XL Owner

    Donut Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Aug 9, 2010
    Messages:
    521
    Likes Received:
    1,042
    I've carried a Lil Matriarch Serrated some and it works fine for normal cutting. Works well on cardboard, plastic wrap, and I can't remember everything I've cut with it.

    I carry a Plain Edge Dodo to the gym with me almost every day. I've used that to open a number of boxes. It works well and it is light and a good size.

    I use a Serrated Cricket as a money clip, that thing works well for cutting off wrist bands with the curved spine.
     
  15. Todd C.
    • +1 Supporter

    Todd C. Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2016
    Messages:
    177
    Likes Received:
    401
    I also have the Lil Matriarch but hardly ever carry it. The Harpys blade shape is much more useful as an EDC blade in my opinion.