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Can anybody explain !!

Discussion in 'First Aid Station' started by kidkrylon73, Dec 21, 2012.

  1. airwayguru

    airwayguru Loaded Pockets

    Apr 16, 2011
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    As a full time medical missionary I have traveled through that region (central America) had no problems and some of the other medical teams and missionaries traveling with a full kit have not been stopped before.

    When we leave the states with medical kits and supplies we label everything as medical aid for another country. While in the states we have full medical direction and protocols. So if it is written and you have been trained and you have medical direction you are good to go.
    Dapple likes this.
  2. tower
    • In Omnia Paratus

    tower Loaded Pockets

    Sep 13, 2009
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    Kidkrylon, may I ask what your level of medical expertise is. I have never had a problem traveling with gear, but I don't go flaunting it either.
  3. elgie.l

    elgie.l Loaded Pockets

    Oct 28, 2012
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    For me, the recent stats on medical harm in this country kind of blow the "needed expertise" argument out of the water. Also, I've never ever read or heard of death or massive medical problems in places like mexico where you can walk into a pharmacy and purchase just about any drug or supply you want.

    I'm afraid the ugly truth is that lawmakers get elected and raise campaign funds by catering to special interest groups, that in many cases are protecting their business and industry. The end result is over regulation that in no stretch of the imagination "provides for the general welfare" (read your constitution) of our people.
    kertap75 likes this.
  4. neutrontech
    • In Omnia Paratus

    neutrontech Loaded Pockets

    Jan 24, 2011
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    True. In most cases, banning something causes more harm than good. Either it creates a black market, which fuels crime; or it removes materials and supplies out of the hands of people who could rightfully use them.

    Sent from my tricorder using Tapatalk 1701
    kertap75 likes this.
  5. VinnyP
    • In Omnia Paratus

    VinnyP Loaded Pockets

    Aug 18, 2006
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    For medical supplies surely the idea is that people need to know enough to use them when they are required and, if they can cause harm, not use them when they are not required. In less developed places it's often the case that the people with the requisite skills and knowledge don't have the necessary equipment. So, in those cases, it makes sense to allow the equipment to go with the potential patient. In developed places (like the US) it's often enough the case that the skilled people are in possession of or have ready access to what they need.

    As for some of the comments I am trying to imagine what people need to be able to carry that they can't that is so vital that an "Untrained bumpkin" can appropriately treat you with that can't wait until you can get rescued in even the most remote parts of the US? I think is reasonable to think that if you are going somewhere that needs specialist medical equipment to go there safely then it needs someone qualified to use them. I know there is an argument that it's my body so why can't I do what I like with it, but I think the counter argument that the rescue/responders, medical staff and hospital beds that are used to correct the Bumpkins blunders can be better employed helping those who are less well "prepared".

    I am just back (Literally yesterday) from the Sahara in Algeria and Tunisia and I had a remote medicine pack. I am trained, qualified and know how to use all of it but would look for a doctor to do exactly that. Far more important is a reliable way of getting help like a Sat phone and a PLB, these are both legal in the US but I don't see them getting mentioned very much.
    Last edited by VinnyP, Jan 1, 2013
  6. Flight-ER-Doc

    Flight-ER-Doc Loaded Pockets

    May 9, 2009
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    I have never had a problem traveling with even advanced medical supplies and drugs. Of course, when I travel on medical missions I tend to not bring anything back with me (except maybe my stethoscope), since where ever I am needs the stuff more than I do back home.

    I did get asked about a rather large Pelican case full of drugs (including narcotics) in Africa once (I think it was Tanzania) but when I told them I was taking them to hospital, that was all that was said about it.
  7. CatherineM
    • In Omnia Paratus

    CatherineM Loaded Pockets

    Jun 24, 2011
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    When I used to roam around in what some folks call the third world, I took a sterile suture kit, IV tubing setup and a disposable dental kit. Just wanted to know that if something happened, the doctor, nurse or dentist would be poking me with something sterile. Used the suture kit a couple of times and the dental once. I always left the stuff at the nearest clinic to the airport when I was headed home.

    Sent by Owl Post
  8. thatotherguy

    thatotherguy EDC Junkie!!!!!

    Feb 19, 2012
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    I personally think that a person's kit should revolve around their skill sets- which means that if you have the training and the card to prove it, you get the kit that is the best you can handle with your training.
    I think that the average Joe shouldn't need to worry about long term fixes like stitches- they should worry about stabilizing the person to the best of their ablilities so that they will survive until they get to better professional care.
    For example (this is theoretical) I see a person get shot in a gang fight (or whatever). He is bleeding profusely and needs to get the bleeding slowed NOW. Do I pull out the sutures and get stitching? No. I don't have the training to do that, not to mention it's unethical to do something medically that you're not trained to do because you don't neccesarily know the procedures involved. I'd grab the QuikClot or Israeli bandage in my kit (depending on wound placement) and get the bleeding stopped so that the person can be safely transported to somewhere that can provide better care than I can.
    I carry a "trauma kit"- it's really no more than an advanced booboo kit. That's my skill level. I know exactly how and when to use every single item in that kit- and I could very well save a life with it. If I had more training I would carry more.
    Strayz and FrozenMuffin like this.
  9. Dok J

    Dok J Loaded Pockets

    Jan 23, 2011
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    Maybe you can take the medical supplies in a sealed pack?
    Back when I worked EMT we used to carry a medic kit in the ambulance but, as we didn't have qualification nor permission to use it, it was sealed (tape closing it) with packing date and first expiration date writen on it. If a medic would take command of the ambulance, the kit was opened and used, otherwise it was just strapped to the bench.

    This side of the pond, anestethics and some other medicines are hospital only, so if you get caught with them off-duty you can get into trouble. Syringes, blades and needles are fair play as far as I know.
    I only carry some basic supplies in my FAK. In my experience you'll only need some basic kit and skills to stabilize someone until evac or profesional help comes. But straight needle silk sutures are useful as improvised sewing kit.
    Only meds I see useful outside hospital care are OTC painkillers and adrenaline (for anaphylactic reactions) and, as I have no alergies nor my family and closest friends, only carry some ibuprofen... ;)
    Evilbunnyreviews and Dapple like this.
  10. chmsam

    chmsam Loaded Pockets

    May 28, 2007
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    Not that all FAK items should be or are overly regulated. I'd not want to use a suture kit on anyone but myself and even then only after my other resources proved ineffective. The thought of hitting a nerve or nicking an artery and causing real and permanent damage to myself let alone anyone else is kind of sobering to me.

    But then again I try to realize the limitations of my training and skills. I try to remember that problems with the human body are slightly more complicated than patching a leaky radiator hose or replacing a blown out fuse in a vehicle.

    Unfortunately there are lots of folks who can get in way over their heads without even thinking about it (and that last bit is the root of many of these kinds of problems).

    Most of the US is not "third world" while there are spots that come very close to it. Still given what I know and where I am liable to go, I'm pretty happy with what I know I can do and knowing roughly how fast the pro's can get to a given location.

    So I'm not overly concerned about not being able to carry syringes and a full trauma kit but I know people who would be -- if they even took long enough to think about it. Those are the people that we want to limit access to medical equipment.

    It isn't all just a conspiracy from the pharmaceutical companies. In this country most first aid is a matter of keeping things under control until the real experts get on the scene. Doing more can often do a lot of harm if you are not trained and qualified. Very few of us even on this forum are and we're a lot more ready to handle situations than most people.

    The key is to know what you can do, be prepared to do that, but to also now your limitations and to know when going beyond them can make things worse. Want a good example? A fire extinguisher is an easy thing to use yet people who merely assume they know what to do often end up spreading the fire they are trying to contain and sometimes get themsleves trapped and in a world of hurt.
  11. plumberroy

    plumberroy Loaded Pockets

    Nov 11, 2012
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    You just don't know where to look You can buy syringes injectable antibiotics and many animal vaccines most that come with syringes at most farm stores I gave our dogs seven way vacines myself this fall ( I was taught the correct way to do this by a vet)
    nitrofein likes this.