1. Are you a current member with account or password issues?

    Please visit following page for more information

    Dismiss Notice

Active Shooter College Scenario - Your EDC Choices?

Discussion in 'General EDC Discussion' started by Stryker, Dec 7, 2015.

  1. MTFatboy
    • GITD Manix 2XL Owner
    • In Omnia Paratus

    MTFatboy Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2014
    Messages:
    2,001
    Likes Received:
    18,309
    I'm a grad student again myself, and tried my best to be able to carry on campus:
    Sadly, the bill was killed this time in legislation. (Sorry for the long quote, but it seemed appropriate.) What I'm getting at is, there are movements to enable college students to proactively defend themselves. If more of us embrace and support these movements, things may change.
     
    kertap75 likes this.
  2. kensington

    kensington Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    May 20, 2013
    Messages:
    1,019
    Likes Received:
    2,930
    Since kids were little (oldest are 20 and 23 now) whenever we would sit down, restaraunt, store, hall, house, etc i would ask them what they would do if there was trouble, how would they get out, where is cover, what is avaialable for defense. Then they would roll their eyes at me me and say 'dad...` gave my kids Blur pepper spray for their key rings... They both have flashlights and a multitool from me, i try to make sure they carry but honestly am happy if they have not lost them yet... my daughter routinely goes out with her phone, id and keys only which she knows just kills me. My son, if he remebers his keys i am happy. Many kids are oblivious these days. It is definitely different for the littles, they are fully baked in my edc routine.
     
  3. Tropicheat

    Tropicheat Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2012
    Messages:
    72
    Likes Received:
    65
    Online courses. Your campus is your living room. That's what I did for most of my classes. If that's not an option I guess you better have all your escape routes memorized and a nice pepper spray.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  4. les snyder

    les snyder Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Mar 26, 2013
    Messages:
    848
    Likes Received:
    1,642
    situational awareness was impressed upon me in a kindler, gentler setting... my college days were in the late 60s when combat vets from Viet Nam were returning home... the pathway to the library on the Univ of Florida campus was a lighted path among trees in a plaza... I noticed certain groups male students that would not use the path, but would walk along the tree line in the shadow of the lighted area....
     
  5. Karmakanic

    Karmakanic Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2014
    Messages:
    588
    Likes Received:
    661
    My Nike American Eagle racing flats.
     
  6. GrobTheory

    GrobTheory Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Oct 18, 2015
    Messages:
    413
    Likes Received:
    4,552
    i hate to say it but uhhh. i will. carry anyways. better to be tried by 12 than carried by 6.
     
    ThreeWulfMoon and MCPOWoller like this.
  7. Moco

    Moco Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Apr 15, 2014
    Messages:
    867
    Likes Received:
    1,852
    this is reality for me, i carry my embassy pen and some OC spray. i still carry a knife since i know i can get away with it even if it technically is illegal. my conceal carry unfortunately would have much bigger consequences so i just have to leave it at home or in car and park off campus but i dont like leaving it in my car
     
  8. Chimay

    Chimay Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2012
    Messages:
    811
    Likes Received:
    754
    Regardless of what you can or can't carry if you are worried about an active shooter situation then you need to carry items for the following uses. You may not be able to run and hiding or fighting with nothing may not go well.

    1) Trauma treatment that you can use on yourself. First responders will not stop to help you or others until the shooter is taken care of. So think through what you may need to be able to deal with to stabilize yourself or someone else and learn how to use it.
    2) "Area denial". Kevlar string, door stops, anything that you could use to help secure an area or slow the guy attacker down. Look at the doors where you go and figure out a way to secure each type. Carry whatever you can get away with. Chains and locks could be great, but may not be practical to carry and may draw attention to you.
    3) anything to give you an edge in a fight. A flash light, OC spray (practice with it, know how it shoots etc. spray your self so you can get desensitized to it and run or fight through it), nasty pen, whatever you can get away with carrying.

    Basically think through your plans, possibilities and try to find anything that can give you an advantage. If you don't have it on you, you won't have it when it counts. So prioritize your clothing to carry the important stuff. Have a bag you can keep near you, move with, easily access what you need, etc and don't ever be far from it.
     
  9. qkarl

    qkarl Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2014
    Messages:
    52
    Likes Received:
    70
    If your school has strict weapon laws, then ranged weapons like slingshots are probably not allowed either, so carry "materials to construct an improvised slingshot-like thing"? There are pepper spray guns coming into the market but there's still a long way to go in that direction. Ideally I'd like to see someone invent a multishot, nonlethal ranged weapon that's just as effective a few inches away as it is across a lecture hall.
     
  10. DCBman

    DCBman Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2014
    Messages:
    945
    Likes Received:
    1,707
    Along the theme of the 'Run, Hide, (or Fight)' posted by Kertap, here's something most people don't think about (and they really should). In any emergency situation (not just the one the OP has cited) situational awareness is absolutely key. Under everyday normal conditions you should always make yourself aware of areas in your environment, areas I call "where people DON'T go". These areas can include service areas, back of house areas, mechanical and utility areas (trash rooms, etc.). These areas are usually 'out of sight/out of mind' kind of areas, they don't have big signs saying "GO HERE!" (more likely signs which say "Employees Only", etc.) They are usually subdued, low visibility and out of the way corridors, doors and rooms. Some of them are dirty, smelly, wet...and the general public just don't tend to ever gravitate there.

    When it comes to escape and evade, these are the places you want to get to as quickly as possible. Bad guys are unlikely to look for people in these areas, and you will often have an unobstructed path of egress from there. People lull themselves into believing things like Fire Codes only apply to 'paying customers' (if you will), but this isn't true. Fire Code (and correspondent Emergency Exit) requirements apply to every single person in the building and all the spaces they occupy. You cannot get occupancy permits for any space which doesn't have an egress path. Most times these out of the way egress paths will be far less congested than the main egress paths. Plus, bad guys love to guard the main exits because they know that's where all the people will go to eventually.

    Remember; go where people don't go. In an active shooter situation this may well save your life.
     
    mizedog, qkarl and Water-Rat like this.
  11. Excalseras

    Excalseras Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2015
    Messages:
    68
    Likes Received:
    236
    This is relevant to me.

    Honestly, these facilities aren't really designed too well. Too open, no solid indoor cover, no easily accessible fire extinguishers, more to rant about bla bla bla. I always keep my situational awareness set high(sit facing near doors & potential cover, scanning, OODA, etc). No firearms, but I do carry a knife or two(3"? Bah humbug, mine are close enough) and always have my backpack on me with FAK and ropes/etc. And if there is a situation, I'd rather not put myself close enough to the aggressor(s) to use OC or any kind of spray; that's what the knives are for.

    I was actually talking about this situation with a friend. Since projectiles aren't allowed, lasers are a loophole. If you can't leave asap, run far, hit the deck, and shine 'em in the eyes from further away. Another one of my friends has a laser that's powerful enough that the blue beam is visible and cutting it with a hand causes a tingling/slight burning.


    So there is my $0.02, and I have yet to find a nice green, purple, or blue laser. :p
     
    Last edited by Excalseras, Mar 7, 2016
  12. Water-Rat

    Water-Rat Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2013
    Messages:
    1,555
    Likes Received:
    3,118
    I disagree on this one. In general, a spray would have the same or better range than most hand weapons. A knife has the range of my arm length plus 3 inches. A spray has the range of my arm plus several feet. A knife is a particularly bad tool to use as a weapon, mainly because the only way to really get someone to where they can't hurt you anymore using a knife is to kill them immediately. I don't think that knives have the ability to temporarily immobilize someone the way a blunt object or a spray can. Also, in some places, like where I live, attacking someone with a knife, even in purpose of self defense can get you in trouble. Even carrying a knife without a blatant legit purpose can get you in trouble here.

    Unless I get something vital, after I slash an average bad guy, he's going to keep coming. If said bad guy gets sprayed, he'll be temporarily blinded, maybe even temporarily incapacitated. If I whack said bad guy with a backpack, chair, or other convenient blunt object, at the worst, he's going to back up a second to figure out what's going on. I was hit in the head with a backpack once. It wasn't fun. Yeah, there was no lasting damage, but I did backup and move away to figure out what happened.

    As far as taking cover inside a room if you want to fight back, the best spot is next to the door, but out of sight. He'll be focused on the center of the room coming in. When he's in the doorway, he has no place to go and is a sitting duck target for a chair, backpack, or other blunt object.

    A laser might give you a few seconds of distraction to get yourself or other people out of the line of fire. Bear in mind that it will also make you a target.

    The tricky thing with hiding is knowing the difference between cover and concealment. Cover can take a bullet, concealment cannot. Hiding in a closet won't matter if the walls are drywall and the bad guy sprays the wall with gunfire. If a wall is a more solid material, you will have both cover and concealment. The best method for cover though, is to put an entire building between you and the bad guy.
     
  13. DCBman

    DCBman Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2014
    Messages:
    945
    Likes Received:
    1,707
    I should have qualified my post. First, my recommendations aren't for everyone! You must understand your environment (completely), and the people in it.

    I feel remiss; I've had some very specialized training, which others may/most may not have had, working in international environments for many years (some pretty dangerous, others more so).

    FEAR is an understandable human emotion. People react in predictable ways. My point is...don't react in the way which is predictable, do something different. Some/most, bad-guys even, use fear to their advantage. The smart operator will take fear out of his equation. In fact, one must turn that same fear right back around on them.

    Job #1 is to just disappear. In a crowd, one takes the innocuous silent left turn when no one else is paying attention (and vanishes). There's no magic, no "Bruce Lee", no "Chuck Norris"...no "Jason Bourne"; there's just "be gone/invisible", fold back into your environment.

    My goal is to just pass on some of the things anyone can do in an extreme/dangerous situations.

    Bottom line...get back to what you know, and what you can support...FAST! You're whole "World" depends on it!
     
    Water-Rat likes this.
  14. DCBman

    DCBman Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2014
    Messages:
    945
    Likes Received:
    1,707
    Leave no injuries, no blood (no bodies)...nothing, behind if you can avoid it...leave no trace.

    You weren't there.

    ...and...now we truly do go to the Dark side............

    Anonymity is an ART. Some might call it a 'science', but it is more art than science. I digress...

    The OP asked about an "active shooter" situation at a college. It's sad we have to deal with such a situation in the US (with the media hype and all), but the reality is there are many "active shooter" situations worldwide which never make the news. I've tried to offer some help for situations regardless of where a person is.

    One's best bet in an active shooter situation is to "disappear"...and this is my point. Survival / restraint is the better part of valor. Live to fight another day.
     
    Last edited by DCBman, Mar 7, 2016
    Water-Rat likes this.
  15. DCBman

    DCBman Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2014
    Messages:
    945
    Likes Received:
    1,707
    Update...

    I am sorry, this thread just struck a nerve. I've had the misfortune to be in some very untoward situations (professionally) in my life. There is no bravado, none.

    Many of these were some time ago, and not things I would care to repeat, but there are lessons to be learned from them...and that is all I am trying to share.

    Now, I just like my simple EDC stuff; just going to work, at a normal job, and having things/supplies, which I know will help me and my loved ones just be a little bit more comfortable during difficult times.

    My apologies...sincerely.
     
    rca2016 and Water-Rat like this.
  16. qkarl

    qkarl Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2014
    Messages:
    52
    Likes Received:
    70
    Great insight! I hadn't really thought about this aspect of things. Such places especially at night are associated with danger so people have a somewhat subconscious desire to avoid those places. They'd be a good place to go to during an active shooter situation.
     
  17. baccar-3

    baccar-3 Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2014
    Messages:
    1,489
    Likes Received:
    7,613
    If you're in a situation where a maniac with an AK-47 (or any other gun) is shooting anything and everything---You are screwed unless you have a gun to shoot back with.
    Find a place to hide and look for anything that you may be able to use as a weapon.
     
  18. Municipal_Jedi

    Municipal_Jedi Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2009
    Messages:
    786
    Likes Received:
    345
    The I Dream of Jeannie bottle (with Jeannie) so I can GTFO.
     
  19. ThreeWulfMoon

    ThreeWulfMoon Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2011
    Messages:
    377
    Likes Received:
    392
    GrobTheory makes a good point and I carry in gun free zones here in KY except in federal buildings, schools, and hospitals, where the signs do carry the force of law rather than being "friendly" suggestions. However, as an emergency responder who has been in several full-scale active shooter drills, if you are carrying in a gun free zone and you are anywhere near where an active shooter event takes place, you will likely be searched and arrested. During the first full-scale exercise I took part in, a secondary suspect posing as a victim was loaded into an ambulance while having a concealed firearm. So we revised our procedures to now secure an area in a safe zone, post officers there, and bring all subjects there to be searched and given further instructions. I'd say most agencies are doing it this way now, so unless you get out in the first rush away from the shooting, you will likely be searched by law enforcement. If you have a gun, you will be detained at the very least, and most likely arrested.
     
    Water-Rat likes this.
  20. Emeraldalkaline

    Emeraldalkaline Loaded Pockets

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2015
    Messages:
    117
    Likes Received:
    417
    Great thread and very relevant to me. Last semester at my school a drunken football player took pot shots at MY residence hall early in the morning with a pistol. Albeit I was asleep but my friends were up and heard the shots, even saw them impact the outside wall. Thank god the guy was just a drunk mess playing with his handgun but it really got my attention and I still feel nervous sometimes. (School is University of South Florida if you're curious) doesn't help the area around it is very... Sketchy too.

    I like the ideas of carrying a door stop and FAK. Two things I think I'll definitely put in my school bag. I EDC a knife because it's allowed on school grounds but I don't plan on bringing a knife to a gunfight. Might be good to get a bigger light than my keychain flashlight too, if like a few of you mentioned, power is cut out or I need to signal for help.

    I guess my plan would be to hole myself up in a small, manageable area that's out of the way and hold my ground until help arrived or the shooter was taken down. Something like a custodial closet. I know it contradicts better judgement but on the off chance I would be near the "bad guy" if I hid in a small area and kept my EDC knife out, as soon as they opened the door I could jump them. But I wouldn't count on that, being a heavy, clumsy mess.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
    camporama likes this.