Input from real street guys.

[jackknife]

Last week I very narrowly escaped a muggiing by using a little Buck Hartsook, and some very bad language on two would be robber punks. I feel I lucked out, and they felt maybe my wallet was not worth getting cut over. By a round about way I found out I was right.

For the past month I've been going down to the V.A. hospital where I am an outpatient for my medical care. Some months ago my better half and other family members urged me to see someone about possable depression. I was dionosed with depression, and put in a group thereapy that meets every Tuesday afternoon. Its been about 8 sessions now, and I've gotten to know my fellow depressed vets fairly well. Well enough to talk openly about things. (hang on, I'm getting there) When we meet, we talk about how our week has been, and if we had any problems, and how we delt with them. A shrink sits in and supervises, and helps us annalize ourselves. Part of the program is to each week prop each other up and encourage each other to keep going and keep clean. Most have a kicked drug habit, I have a problem with a little too much love of Evan Williams. I tend to have a drinking problem I'm trying to get a handle on.

I'm the only white guy there, as the Washinton D.C. VA medical center is in a not so good part of D.C. Irving street to be exact. The other guys are all African American with two females, all from the lower lever of ecomonics in D.C. That means they come from poor areas with lots of crime. In the course of conversation my Hartsook wielding adventure came out, and we had a very interesting talk on street crime, weapons, criminals, and assosiated subjects.

Theres this one big guy I'll call Harvey. He reminds me in a vague way of actor Forrest Whittiker, a big hulking sort of guy who I wouldn't imagine to have any problems on the street. It'd be like a couple wild dogs trying to bring down a buffalo. But he's served prison time for a felony arrest, and has had drug problems. Having a felony record he carries a big walking stick. It looks like he just took a strait branch off a large oak tree, and put a rubber table end on the bottom. Its like a short staff, just comming up to his lower most rib. Looks like he could brain an ox with it. He had the following to say on his choice of street weapons.

Most criminals having a record, don't want to carry a gun for a simple street mugging. Save the gun for war with other gangs on thier turf. Too risky getting cought in a shake down. So they use a cheap kitchen paring knife to intimidate an easy looking white guy dressed real nice, to give up his wallet and cell phone. Soon as they are out of sight, they ditch the weapon, the now empty wallet, and chuck the cell phone too. They only take the cell phone to keep you from calling the police, and give them more get away time. The know your gonna call Verizon and cancel the service quick, and its not worth getting cought with a cell phone that ain't yours. Harvey also told me that I got away with using a small knife because the size of the knife really does not matter. Getting cut in the commiting of a fellony is a very bad thing on the street. They don't want anything to be able to conect them with you. Having to go to the hospital to get stitches can seal thier fate, and they know it. Having no contact with "the system" is of major importance. If a target looks like it's going to fight back with anything that can inflict damage, the tactic then goes to get the heck out of there, and go find another, safer target. Doesn't matter if its a small knife, box cutter (a particularly respected weapon) broken bottle, tire iron, what ever.

Durring our talk we're sitting outside in the nice grassy picknic area, smoking and nursing cups of coffee from the coffee bar inside the front door. Another guy we'll call Fred, and one of the two women in the group we'll call Mary, chip in thier take on it.

I asked Mary, a compact woman about young middle age and a nurse vet from the first gulf war, as a woman living in and walking the D.C. streets, how she deals with it. With a coy smile, she takes out a Stanley sliding blade utility knife from her purse, and with a smooth practiced movement had the blade out in a blink. "Honey, some low life grabs me, he's gonna be opened up like a zipper bag."

The subject turned to knives, and they all agreed it was a waste of money to have an expensive knife, or a very large one, for defending oneself. They all agreed that a good slasher that could be replaced easy and cheap was a good thing. Fred, who has also served jail time, said "Man, you don't need no Rambo knife, just have a sharp one and make the dude clear on it that you gonna cut him good if he gets in range. He ain't there to fight wit ya, he wants to get it over wit in half a minute or less and be outa there. Don't want no attention or knife fight takin place on the sidewalk wit a dozen people callin the man. Who knows, maybe even a off duty man in sight of the happining."

But the bottom line was something that was a little surprise. I had noticed before many times a very great number of men at the VA had rough looking walking stick/canes. Most seemed to be made from a part of a tree, with knobs and slight crooks. Some had been lovingly finished, being sanded down, stained, varnished, with some african designs whittled into the wood or burned in with a small soldiering iron. Some were very good looking. One of my vet group pointed out what I had missed. Most of them did not need a cane for walking. But most of them carried a big stout stick/short staff as a main weapon. Fred said a street punk/mugger is not going to go jack up a guy walking normal but carrying a stick. The stick is sending a message that there is going to be some swinging, and its too much chance of getting hurt. Again, the criminal is shying off because it looks too much like a fight may take place.

It was an interesting aftenoon chat at the picnic table with citizens of D.C.'s more dangerous nieghborhoods. Seems like a stout stick and a box cutter are seen as effective tools in some quarters.

Thought I'd share it with you guys.

[hawkeye]

great post, thanks! It definitely reinforces what I have been told regarding street crime - Do not be the defenseless easy target!

Even with no weapon, how you carry yourself, and making eye contact with everyone, goes a long way toward making bad guys look for an easier target.

Thing is - if you do carry a weapon, please do two things - know how to use it, and be prepared to use it. That will give you the confidence you need to achieve the above, and failing that, to effectively deploy the force without hesitation.

[Goliath]

Good story, thanks for sharing.

However, I don't completely agree with it. It might be different in the US than here in the Netherlands, but still.
Some studies have showed, that if you draw a knife or similar kind of weapon (most are illegal anyway, even pepperspray can only be used by the cops) the robbers would react even more agressively.
I'm sure some would back off but I'm also sure some would indeed draw a knife too, and you don't want that to happen.

In my opinion, it's better to just hand over the wallet and phone - you can replace those things but you can't replace your own life...

[greenLED]

Some studies have showed, that if you draw a knife or similar kind of weapon (most are illegal anyway, even pepperspray can only be used by the cops) the robbers would react even more agressively.

I'd like to see links to those studies, so I can learn more.

[Goliath]

I'd like to see links to those studies, so I can learn more.

Sorry, I can't find those. Besides, the one I'm talking about are written in Dutch anyway so it wouldn't be of much use to you.

[Jambo]

Great post, thanks for sharing that.

[kirbysdl]

Sorry, I can't find those. Besides, the one I'm talking about are written in Dutch anyway so it wouldn't be of much use to you.

I think GreenLED's trying to gently say that your arguments need a bit more support. After all, the arguments in the OP make sense... going for easier targets, not wanting to expose themselves to injury, etc.

Sometimes people will just go out of their way to make trouble and not worry about the consequences. But for the most part, the reasoning in the OP holds. If you can't provide the fulltext to those studies, can you back up their findings with similar reasoning?

[greenLED]

I think GreenLED's trying to gently say that your arguments need a bit more support. After all, the arguments in the OP make sense... going for easier targets, not wanting to expose themselves to injury, etc.

Guilty as charged, your honor. :) Well, sort of...

I'd actually like to learn "the other side" of the story. All I've been exposed to points in the direction of BG's looking for "soft" targets, and matches the POV shared in the OP.

[illusion]

Thanks for sharing this with us Jackknife, great read!

I live in Europe and I have noticed that the streets have become harder the last 10-15 years. knives are not legal to carry around here ( need a good reason, like work,hunting), but still the people have become more aggressive with knives lately(kitchen knives is a big hit).

The violence is much harder now, in the old days they just give you an black eye and walk away. Now they stand and kick you for 5 min if you are lucky.

(haven't experienced any of this, but just what I have observed)

[Dirty Bob]

I've had multiple street encounters with low-lifes, and the thing that has saved me (along with a fast retreat) is the willingness and ability to defend myself. Jackknife's point about injury rings true.

It seems as though the goblins I've dealt with had a script in their heads, and when something changed how the story was going, they aborted the attempted crime. It shows intelligence and adaptability. Once they lose control of the situation, or something seems weird, they're outta there! How many stories have we all read in the papers about people getting caught doing a crime? It seems that a lot of them were guys who went right ahead, even when their planned crime was spinning out of control.

I think that a lot of people who get into street crime do it for a quick, easy buck. Any target that doesn't look like easy prey is likely to be bypassed for an easier victim somewhere else.

Stay safe,
Dirty Bob