Smith & Wesson 340/340PD Revolver-Thoughts, Comments, Suggestions, etc.

[0dBm]

When in the yard relaxing, barbequeing, generally goofing off and just plain hanging out, my stainless steel S&W 640 with the full underlug just gets plain heeeeaveee after a few hours.* Now I know that the 640 can take pounding with full bore, 125-grain HPs all day long but these J-frames are meant to be carried more than fired.

I decided that I will be getting the 340 or 340PD before year end.* At 12 ozs. empty and about 13.5 with 5 Cor-Bon 115-grain 38 +Ps, it should make for the ultimate EDC "roscoe."* Ti/scandium makes it coooool! ;D

For those owners, your thoughts on multi-hour carry, carry rigs, ammo choices, general carryabilty, etc, please.

For will-be owners, what would you expect this featherweight to bring to the table, if any, over your current EDC.

For some of us, we have others that we fall back to if the feces should hit the sanyo oscillator, but those are not as EDC friendly.* This candidate sure looks like the ideal.

[Goldtanker]

OK 'roscoe". ;D I have a 340 and a 340PD (layering). For me (an old guy with 27 years on the job) it is my choice for carry, even though I have many autos and other wheel guns. I like the '5 for sure', no snags and no stovepipes. Carry it in the pocket and shoot it in there. As a CCW basic last resort defense weapon I think it is hard to beat. You might be involved in 'contact' shooting when someone gets close and a lot of autos go out of battery in that instance and won't fire. If you get in a situation where you need more that 5 rounds (I carry a speed strip anyway) it is probably not defensive and you might be in trouble. Ammo? - Winchester 145 Gr. Silvertip .357(as reviewed in Combat Hangun Magazine). Powerful enough to drop a deer but not so likely to go through the car behind your target. In hot weather I carry the 340 in an Aker ankle holster which I leave it in because it is easy to draw but not so easy to holster. Cargo pants make it invisible. Cool weather and winter, I carry the 340PD with LaserGrips in either a JS Holsters pocket holster or Bell Charter Oak, Co-Pilot(cross draw, appendix location). As you already know, these are not target or plinker guns, but serious defense weapons. Like you, I have an old stainless Model 49 that feels like an anvil in comparison the the 340. I also agree on the Ti/Scandium factor. ;)

[0dBm]

GT, how's the recoil on the 340 with the Silvertips at 145-grain?

Akers has some good stuff!

My 640 has been riding in a Lou Alessi IWB rig with the Zytel Talon Clip. When the 340 arrives, that will be it's new home.

[Goldtanker]

Recoil is strong but by no means unmanageable. I just read some good things about that particular round so thats why i carry it. The gun is so light it will be harsh with just about anything though. But it is a defense weapon that a guy is likely to carry which is why I would recommend it.

[0dBm]

The 145 Silvertip is a great round in my old Smith (long sold) 686. O0

I stopped by a local gun store today and handled the 340. You can wear that on a necklace on your neck! It' so lightweight! I notice that the front sight is replaceable. The XS Tritium/Big Dot would be great there.

[konrad]

the 340 is the limit for me, amy lighter needs to be a corresponding lighter caliber. Practice is important.

[0dBm]

I often wonder if the 340 could be made with the H&R .32 Magnum. This cartridge would allow for 6 instead of 5 cartridges.

[Jim101]

NAA will be releasing a .32 Mag later this year, all of us that are looking for a "light" carry are waiting for it....

Jim

[0dBm]

I noticed that the 340's (http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10001&storeId=10001&productId=14764&langId=-1&isFirearm=Y) has a flat ground on each side of the barrel.* Same for the underlug on one side.* This removes a few more tenths of an ounce and updates this time-honored design for the new millennium.* Nice touch.

[Toolboy]

At 12 ozs. empty and about 13.5 with 5 Cor-Bon 115-grain 38 +Ps, it should make for the ultimate EDC "roscoe." Ti/scandium makes it coooool! ;D



The side of the barrel states nothing smaller than 125 grains, so you may have to step up the bullet size a bit.

I carry the 340 PD daily as a backup with 5 38 +P gold dots....for a reload I have a Bianchi strip witth 5 gold dot .357 mags.

The gun is unpleasant to shoot with just about any ammunition, however, it does its job well and is so easy to carry that you will be unlikely to leave it at home. A worthy carry gun (or I wouldn't carry one).

[0dBm]

The side of the barrel states nothing smaller than 125 grains...

Maybe I'll feed it with the Federal 125-grain Personal Defense stuff. I've had good performance from them in my 640. Is that a lanyard loop on the butt?

Also, is the trigger itself Ti? How 'bout the rest of the moving parts?

[Dave in PA]

I realize you asked about the Ti models, but how about a 642? I have one and the price is certainly better. You could use the left over money for ammo or training. For carry, I really don't see much difference between the 340 and 642. For shootin/training, I do.

Just a thought for possible consideration.

Dave

[Goldtanker]

Re: lanyard attachment - Nothing in the manual about it but that is what I thought it was. I think just the cyclinder is Ti.

[Goldtanker]

Now that I'm thinking about this again I remember the problem with the bullet weight relates to magnums. The manual says: "Do not use Magnum loadings with bullet weights of less than 120gr. This will reduce the possibility of premature cyclinder erosion." When I inquired ( over two years ago), I was told that magnum loads under 120gr use faster burning powders that cause quicker erosion. The manual has no such warning for .38 ammo. There is also an"unseating" problem with certain types of ammo, mainly unjacketed, in these light weapons due to recoil. Some bullets come loose from the casing. For your own peace of mind, a call to Smith might be in order to ensure the ammo you want to use is OK. Maybe there is a gunsmith in the forum?

[Toolboy]

There is also an"unseating" problem with certain types of ammo, mainly unjacketed, in these light weapons due to recoil.* Some bullets come loose from the casing.

This is the problem that I have heard of, but never experienced myself. The bullets, according to rumor, can become unseated then block the cylinder from rotating, creating a jam that is nearly impossible to clear in the field.

That being said, I've never seen it happen or heard of it from anyone who has had it happen to them. However, the bullet weight limitation is actually engraved into the side of the barrel, so I'm guessing S&W is pretty serious about it.

[Goldtanker]

I never experienced it either but it is not limited to magnum rounds. My guess is that if you are using old or poor quality ammo, expecially lead semi's, you might see this. I think that good quality fresh jacketed stuff would be ok. The manual says to try the rounds you are using, fire four and check the fifth for stability. Is there a gunsmith/S&W armorer in the house? ;D

[Toolboy]

People really read the manual? :-X

[0dBm]

OK. I fired one yesterday with 125-grain, .357 Mag Federal. All I can say is OUCH: it hurt!! :( I fired my 640, too. It hurt MUCH LESS than the 340.

Why can't the 340 be made in .32 Magnum with 6 instead of 5 in the chamber?

[Goldtanker]

Sure your hand hurt - but think of how the target felt. ;D

[Toolboy]

OK. I fired one yesterday with 125-grain, .357 Mag Federal. All I can say is OUCH: it hurt!! :( I fired my 640, too. It hurt MUCH LESS than the 340.


I told ya it hurt. :)

I was suprised at how unpleasant this gun is to shoot with magnum rounds. I've heard it is only matched/beat by the .44 mag scandium/titanium trail gun that S&W put out not too long ago.

Guys at the shop told me that shooting the full sized 500 S&W is more pleasant.

[0dBm]

Good thing that the .357 is a pretty effective "stopper" per Marshal and Sanow. That said, I don't know how effective the cartridge would be in that short barrel. The 340 is definitely a "carried alot and shot very little" type.

[Goldtanker]

Yup. Definitely not a target gun. But when you really need it, it will do the job reliably and recoil will be the last thing on your mind. You might try the 145 Gr. Winchester Silvertip personal protection round. It was specially developed to reduce the inherent .357 muzzle flash, blast and over-penetration.

[Lawrence]

I may be wrong, but I believe there IS a 32 mag six shot version of the scandium snubby.

I know a guy...a doctor..who carries the 340 PD in his pocket while jogging, and while hiking and camping.

He says the recoil is stout, but not too bad.

If the gun weren't so freakin expensive, Id love to have one. I had a back injury early last year that has pretty much permanently screwed me up. Ive had to give up carrying my Glock 17 and gone back to my G26 in a galco shoulder rig because the bigger gun hurts my back too much.

(I know it sounds silly, but trust me, ask anyone with a chronic back injury..especially someone who walks on a cane like I do.).


I'd love to have one to stick in the pocket of my photographers vest. It would be a great alternative to carrying a mouse gun.


Those 340PDs are $900 bucks...aren't they??

[Goldtanker]

Lawrence - They are $640, which is up from $600 when I got mine two years ago.

[Cthulhu]

Hey All, Just joined up and found my way to the handguns forum. As a sometime employee at my states largest independent gunshop, I thought I'd chime in.

S&W made a 6rnd lightweight aluminum (no scandium, although weight is virtually the same) J-Frame Snub, in the form of the S&W 431PD (hammered)and 432PD (hammerless). Each are around 13.5oz empty, which is a little heavier than the 340/360 due to the smaller .32 cal holes in them. I say made as S&W recently discontinued all their .32 H&R pistols. Luckily with S&W you can never really count any model as gone for good.

The biggest complaints I've heard from users is the poor availability of defensive loads for the .32 and the rather anemic loadings of those factory loads. Most top out at 100grn bullet at 1000fps, somewhere around the top load of a .380acp.*

The choice then becomes whether decreased recoil and 20% increase in ammo are a worthy trade for a 50%+ decrease in power.

If you are recoil sensitive then it might not be a bad idea to hunt one down. Recoil is similar to a steel .38 J-frame. Nothing like 340PD with 125grnrs. A few of us gunshop geeks actually fired a box of 180 Corbon BCSP loads through a 340PD..Ouch.

For those wanting to tame the 340PD with magnum loads, try the LG-405 Laser Grips. They have an airspace in the backstrap grip that significantly reduces recoil without adding much bulk. Valuable even if you don't use the laser sight.

[JonSidneyB]

Try a 640 with a Barami Hip Grip. It will seem lighter. The closer to the sent of the body the lighter it will seem.

In jacket pockets in like the 442. I have not carried one of the Scandium revolvers but they are lighter. The 442 has made me happy however.

[jamz]

I did this review a few weeks ago for some other forums I'm on...

First Impressions:

This is the first new revolver I’ve ever bought. All of my other ones were bought used, and were built in the 1970s, 80s or early 90s. I had never bought a revolver with an internal lock, but I wanted this gun so much that the lock became a non-factor.

Picking it up out of the box, it is light as hell. I remember the first time I ever picked up a 340pd a year or so ago, it felt like it was made out of plastic. IT practically jumped up from the table… of course I had been carrying an old Model 60 snubby, an all stainless gun that weighed in at around sixty pounds. Felt like the hard rubber Hogue type stocks were at least half the weight of the gun, so I replaced them with my much more handsome and carryable Ahrends Cocobolo stocks.

Hearing some negative things about new guns from S&W, I carefully inspected it from all angles, looking for scratches, nicks, dents or anything of the like. It appeared to be in very good shape, except for the white lettering stamped into the barrel. The “357 S&W Mag” marking was stamped well into the barrel, but the white anodizing was very faint, where it was bright and clear on both the “No less than 120 gr bullet” and the funky S&W atom logo thingy.

http://www.4jamz.com/pix/pd1.jpg

Dry firing the 340pd was not comforting exactly, and the trigger pull was considerably stiffer than the model that I had tried in the store. You have to overcome serious initial resistance before the trigger moves back in one swift movement and the hammer releases. It is difficult to pull the trigger slowly and in a controlled way due to the stiff initial pull- once you put that much pressure on it, when it gives, it goes back all the way. After dry firing it a few hundred times, the trigger becomes much smoother, with a more controllable pull back. Later on at the range I was able to smoothly pull the trigger back with no drama.

When the hammer falls it makes a non-confidence-inspiring “tinngggg” sound that resonates a little bit, very different from the solid bank-vault like CLICK that an old steel gun makes. In addition, it seemed to me to be too easy to release the trigger just short of the stop so when you pull it again it rotates the cylinder, but does not actually engage the internal hammer.

I can’t have a new gun in my possession for more than a few hours before firing it, so despite having a cold, and being pressed for time, on the way home I found an old dirt road, went a ways down and opened up the trunk to see what kind of ammo I could find. I found a bag of handloaded .38spl rounds that I knew to be pretty gentle- plinking rounds. The lighter powered rounds fired as expected, slight recoil, no big deal. A couple of Winchester White Box .38 +p Personal Protection rounds later proved that it was a good, controllable gun that I could put multiple shots on target, quickly.


When I finally got to the range a couple of weeks later I was ready with the WWB +p 125 grain, Speer 125 Grain .38spl +p, and Speer 125 Grain 357 magnum HP rounds, several water jugs, a chronograph, some targets and a shooting glove.

http://www.4jamz.com/pix/pdreview/setup.jpg
http://www.4jamz.com/pix/pdreview/setup2.jpg


The first order of business was to chrono the three types of rounds and see if .357 was significantly better. At the same time I’d test the grouping and accuracy from a two handed, kneeling position. Based on strings of ten shots, the average velocity of all 125 grain bullets were as follows:

Winchester: 749.6 feet per second
Speer 38 +p: 826.1 feet per second
Speer .357: 1090.3 feet per second

Which means as far as energy delivered to target:
Winchester +p: 155.92 ft-lbs
Speer +p: 189.37 ft-lbs
Speer .357: 329.87

Looks like .357 out of a snubby delivers TWICE as much energy to the target than .38+p! Clearly .357 out of a snubby is considerably more potent than .38+p, so don't listen to the gun shop commandos. So much for the myth of there being no difference between .38 and .357 out of a snubby! The .357 was significantly faster, and the Speer was loaded a bit hotter than the Winchester. Now let’s look at the targets.

Winchester .38 +p Personal protection
http://www.4jamz.com/pix/pdreview/wwb.jpg

Speer Gold Dot .38+p (Ignore the WWB box, I put it there by mistake.)
http://www.4jamz.com/pix/pdreview/speer38.jpg

Speer Gold Dot .357
http://www.4jamz.com/pix/pdreview/speer357.jpg

Seems that the Speer gold dots grouped significantly better than the Winnies, but didja notice what happened to the accuracy with the .357? :D

Yeah I saw it and I felt it. .38 +p out or this gun is a piece of cake, and I wasn’t expecting .357 to be too much worse… but it was.

I noticed that when I shot, the trigger guard would come up and hit my index finger right at the first knuckle. Didn’t dent it or make it bleed, but it was noticeable. Also noticeable was the kick on the pinkie finger as the grip flicked it out of the way during recoil. The gun otherwise seems to push right back instead of flip up. The first shot was surprisingly powerful, and stung my hand. The second shot stung more. The third shot actually hurt my wrist! And this was with a padded shooting glove on! No wonder my accuracy went to hell. 

So it seems that the best grouping and accuracy comes from the Speer GD .38+p, which is probably what I’ll run in it. I noted a small amount of bullet pull in the Speers, but not too much.
http://www.4jamz.com/pix/pdreview/bulletpull.jpg

Let’s do a penetration test! I lined up some water jugs, Box-o-truth style.

http://www.4jamz.com/pix/pdreview/waterjugs.jpg

The first shot skimmed the bottom, holed the first and third jugs, and disappeared, missing the second and fourth jugs. What the heck?
Lining them up again, a better shot penetrated two jugs just barely, leaving the fully expanded JHP nestled there.

http://www.4jamz.com/pix/pdreview/38pexp.jpg

I couldn’t leave without firing barehanded with the .357 rounds.
Eyyouch. I’m a righty, and shoot right handed. The gun slapped back with the first and second stunning rounds, and I became afraid of the third. By the fourth and fifth rounds I was actually pulling the gun back in anticipation of the recoil. Terrible, and I’m not at all recoil shy.

There was no actual blood, but there was considerable pain in the base knuckle in the index finger and the web of the hand. It actually made the index finger and pinkie pains go away in comparison. :p It took me a minute to recover to try another 5 rounds. I really could not do five rounds accurately, really no more than two before my sense of limb self-preservation made me undergo silly gymnastics to compensate for the recoil.

I took exactly one left handed shot- you can never tell if you will have to use your non-dominant hand. It was so bad, I couldn’t do another…unless my life depended on it I suppose. It is a few hours after I shot it and my left thumb still hurts as if I overextended it backwards, which I probably did. Just for fun with one of these shots I fired at a still full water jug that was coming right at me with a knife. It was entirely destroyed.

http://www.4jamz.com/pix/pdreview/357jug.jpg

In conclusion, I think it’s a great gun, and easily controllable with .38 +P, but not controllable for me at any range with .357. Use with that round would be limited to card table distance, and no further- at least not for more than two shots. I am considering carrying it with 3 .38+p and two .357, in that order. The two .357 rounds are all I could fire accurately anyway, and the three .38+P would hopefully get any social work job done with maximum controllability nad speed in followup shots. I’d just have to remember that the last two are real kickers.

A few days later, I found an old Hogue monogrip and installed it, shooting 135 grain .357 rounds. Much more controllable, no real pain, and it gave me all the confidence I'd need for carrying 5 .357 rounds in this gun.

[JonSidneyB]

I cannot imagine trying to shoot .357 out of a scandium gun. That would hurt my hand soooo bad.

[TKC]

I can't imagine shooting .357 out of a scandium gun either!! Ouchy.

[0dBm]

Very thorough review. O0

[Toolboy]

Excellent review and matches my experience closely. I made the mistake of shooting 50 .38+ps followed by 50 .357s my first time out with this gun. It hurt the thumb of my shooting hand so badly that it actually took about a month for my thumb to stop hurting.

I later replaced the grip with a hogue grip that covered the metal backstrap, and the gun was much easier to shoot with .357s, of course it also decreased the concealability greatly as the grip was now nearly as large as the actual portion of the gun protruding from it.

In the end I ended up putting the S&W Bantam grips back on, and loading it with .38 +p Speer round. It's an EDC now, it's too easy to toss into a pocket to not take it with me.

Great gun...but I've heard that the only gun with worse recoil than this one is the .44 mag scandium Mountain Gun....I don't think I'll even try that one. :)

[shao.fu.tzer]

That's why I prefer shooting Federal 115 grain Hydra-Shoks in my 638. Follow up shots are important. I'd rather plug someone 3 times in 1.5 seconds than twice in 3 seconds.

Shao